Veterans Affairs Committee on June 5th, 2023

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you.

You also mentioned that you had a dedicated case manager who followed up with you on a regular basis today....

[Kathleen Mary Ryan]

Yes.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

I just wanted to hear, from the time that you were released from the centre and with support units being assigned to the case manager now, what was that time frame? Could you share that?

[Kathleen Mary Ryan]

I was posted to what was then the JPSU, I think, in 2015, and I didn't release until 2019. In that time period, they offered me retraining—“re-coursing”—and they would offer me, “What do you expect to do in two years or three years or however...?” As it turned out, I ended up having metastatic breast cancer, and that put everything on hold.

I released in 2019, I think relatively smoothly, but we had a huge hiccup with our.... We lived in PMQs and we asked for an extension to live in PMQs while we got this sorted out, with the cancer and everything, and the housing manager said no. I had a meeting with him. We took it to harassment. That's what I had to go through with my wife.

I served the military. I served the people of Canada for 40 years. Does that not count for extending my PMQ for however long I need to?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Blake Richards]

Thank you.

We will now move on to the next round with the Bloc Quebecois.

Mr. Desilets, you have the floor for two and half minutes.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you.

Ms. Wojcichowsky, you are still part of the Armed Forces. Would you say that, over the last five or six years, the culture has changed within the army? Has it improved?

[MCpl Jacqueline Wojcichowsky]

I could say that it has improved some. With the sexual misconduct, it's slowly improving, but I still think that there is a lot to improve. I did a speech at 3 Division headquarters in December.

I think there still needs to be more. I was supposed to be doing more across Canada about my experience of sexual misconduct.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

If I understand correctly, you're saying that the culture in the army is maybe a little more inclusive when it comes to women.

[MCpl Jacqueline Wojcichowsky]

Can you...?

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Do you see a difference between the place women have in the army today, compared to 5 or 10 years ago? Is the army more inclusive? Do the men accept you more?

[MCpl Jacqueline Wojcichowsky]

When I was an armour crewman, they accepted me back then, in the early 1990s. In the early 1990s they loved me, because they saw me as one of the men. I did exactly what they did. I did everything even back then.

Even now, they accept us as who we are. They accept us.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I will ask you a question that may seem strange to you. Currently, in the army, are you yourself, or do you have to adapt your behaviour to the demands of the men?

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Blake Richards]

You'll have to keep your response fairly brief, if that's okay.

[MCpl Jacqueline Wojcichowsky]

They treat us very well, and they expect us to be us.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Blake Richards]

Thank you, Mr. Desilets.

We now have the New Democratic Party for two and a half minutes.

Mr. Desjarlais, go ahead.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I want to extend my thanks to all of my colleagues around this table. I sit on many committees and it's not often I see such good questions and thoughtful participation in what I think is a very important issue. I want to thank the chair and all of my colleagues, since this will be my final participation in this committee. It's been a pleasure working with all of you, and I hope you continue this good work and continue to value the lives of those who serve Canada.

I'll go directly to one of my questions, which will be directed to Sergeant Ryan.

Sergeant Ryan, you spoke about your participation as a medical technician and, of course, it comes to mind that, as a woman in the Canadian Armed Forces, serving as a medical technician, dealing with the issues of women's health could present a particularly interesting barrier to your practice, considering there hasn't been much attention or appetite to see many of the concerns of women's health actually addressed, and especially in light of the testimony given today.

Are CAF medics given the resources and tools they need to properly care for women in the military? I'm thinking more along the lines of having the appropriate tools—like a rape kit, for example—or the various tools that make your profession easier.

[Kathleen Mary Ryan]

Absolutely. In every clinic, every deployed operation, you will find a rape kit. It's standard issue. The medics are trained in Borden.

If a woman says to me, “I've been raped,” the first thing I do is get the nurse in charge and call the MPs, because there is a process that has to be followed. We're very well trained in that, and I have no complaints about that.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Did you find that the Canadian Armed Forces was able to supply you with the appropriate resources and tools to help those victims in that case?

[Kathleen Mary Ryan]

Today it is, but it wasn't back when I first joined.

There have been important changes in the Canadian Forces health system.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Thank you very much for that.

I know, Sergeant Ryan, that you weren't able to answer this question in my previous round. It was about your experience with transition and how that experience was for you when you exited the Canadian Armed Forces and had to deal with VAC, for example.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Blake Richards]

You'll have to keep the response very brief, please.

[Kathleen Mary Ryan]

It was stressful. There's no doubt. You're not ready for civvy street after 40 years in the military.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Blake Richards]

Thank you for that. That was, in fact, quite brief.

Now we have just enough time, I think, for one more round of questioning each for the Conservatives and the Liberals. I think it will be about three and a half minutes each.

I will go first to the Conservative Party for three and a half minutes.

Mrs. Wagantall, go ahead.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Thank you, Chair.

I thank you all for your contributions today. We will go back and review this, and I believe it will make a difference in our report, so thank you.

Major Seviour, you talked about when the class action lawsuit came into being and this issue around VAC policy and there being nothing there for MST. You went through this experience personally of having a clinical psychiatrist report that wasn't accepted and an expectation that you would go to your GP. You said VAC said they couldn't deal with that and you should go back to get a sensible report because their hands were tied.

Can you explain that, please?

[Joanne Seviour]

I contacted the ombudsman's office. It was the ombudsman's office who shared with me the new policy that didn't mention clinical psychologists. They said they weren't able to change it. It wasn't within the ombudsman's purview. It's for Veterans Affairs to do that.

If you do nothing else but recommend that the reports of clinical psychologists, who are Ph.D. experts in the field, at least be included for female sexual interest disorder and issues related to female sexual trauma, then that would make a difference. It would mean something to me. I think it's important.

Our health care system is in crisis. Physicians don't have time to be filling out paperwork.