Evidence of meeting #67 for Veterans Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was witnesses.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5:10 p.m.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
Thank you very much to my colleague. I appreciate that.
Tell me if I'm hearing this correctly. We often hear about the treatments available related to physical injuries, and there are challenges there, that's true, but can you talk to me about the mental trauma? I've heard what admitting weaknesses does to your mind. Downgraded, released or discharged, all of those impact your mental health. I've also heard the term “sanctuary trauma”, where you're expecting to have that care but it doesn't seem to be there.
Of all those concerns, which one impacted you the most or impacts you the most in moving forward with your lives after service, or is it a combination? How does that work?
I will ask Alice and then Brigitte, please.
5:10 p.m.
Veteran, Vice-President Research and Innovation, Dalhousie University, As an Individual
I didn't have a problem moving forward with my life. I would say that I've stayed intimately tied to the military because I want to see change. I devoted my entire research career to the military. I'm an honorary naval captain. I'm part of the Order of St. George. I really try to give back to the veteran community, because I want to see change.
Did it stop me moving forward in my life? It did not in any way. I think I've done fairly well for myself, and I do attribute some of that to the military. At the young age of 23 I was in charge of a whole group of men who had never had a female boss, and I was too young to think I couldn't do it.
5:10 p.m.
Conservative
Cathay Wagantall Conservative Yorkton—Melville, SK
On that note, I just want to ask you this. Your situation is solid, and that's great. Can you think, from the perspective of boots on the ground, of individuals who would be more like the other witness who was here who—
Are you frozen? I think she is.
Can we move on to Brigitte, then, and maybe come back to her?
5:10 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
Okay. I'll make it short.
When I released from the military, when I was kicked out because of my medical condition, it was for my knee, a physical condition. At that time, I didn't know that I had PTSD. I found out later that I had PTSD, because things were really bad in my life. That's when I went to VAC, because I was already with VAC for my knee. Then, again, I had to fight to prove that I suffered from accidents and a whole bunch of things.
It's pretty hard for somebody to come forward and say, “I think I have a mental condition.”
5:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you so much.
Mrs. Bennett, you have two minutes for a quick intervention, please.
5:10 p.m.
Liberal
Carolyn Bennett Liberal Toronto—St. Paul's, ON
I would love for them.... Whatever you haven't had time to say, please just jump in and finish whatever you need.
5:10 p.m.
Veteran, Vice-President Research and Innovation, Dalhousie University, As an Individual
I would like to thank the committee for your work. Please don't underestimate the seriousness of the suffering of some of my sisters in arms. This is important work you're doing; it's not political. Please take it seriously.
5:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you so much.
Ms. Laverdure, there's still a minute left, if you have something to add.
5:15 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
As my colleague, I would like to thank you for your work, dear members. It's not a simple thing.
We're always going to have to fight for something. However, as I said earlier, the current problem affecting veterans, both men and women, has to do with transition. There has to be a better transition when they leave the Canadian Armed Forces. The people who work in transition centres across Canada are military members who may not even know that they have post-traumatic stress syndrome.
You need experienced people in transition centres across the country.
5:15 p.m.
Liberal
5:15 p.m.
Bloc
Luc Desilets Bloc Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
One thing worries me. At every meeting, I see intelligent and educated people like you, leaders and solid people like you who, despite everything, find it difficult to make their way in this system.
I put myself in the shoes of people who are coming out of the army, returning from missions and having significant psychological difficulties. It must be hell, after going through hell.
Dr. Aiken, do you have any recommendations to add?
5:15 p.m.
Veteran, Vice-President Research and Innovation, Dalhousie University, As an Individual
Perhaps I could give a recommendation. I mentioned that when I released from the military, somebody sat down with me and said that this was what they were going to submit to Veterans Affairs and they would help me get this done. The transition centres don't exactly do that.
As my colleague just said, they are people in the military, who might be struggling themselves. The person who helped me was a public servant, a civilian, who worked in the health system in the military. I really think that getting people there to help people make that transition to Veterans Affairs, if they need the help, would be a critical recommendation.
5:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you, Mr. Desilets.
It's now Ms. Blaney's turn.
Go ahead, Ms. Blaney.
5:15 p.m.
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
Thank you, Chair.
Ms. Laverdure, I will just come to you for one final question. You spoke earlier, with great honesty, about the fact that you're part of the class action suit, and that one of the challenges, if I understood correctly, is that because you're going through that process, your PTSD is really being triggered, and it's a lot harder.
I'm just wondering, when we think about the services from VAC, how that process to contact VAC could be easier when you're in such a vulnerable position.
5:15 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
I don't think VAC cares about the people in the class action.
I was thrown from one person to the other. The reason I was thrown from one to the other was that I already had PTSD from my previous accidents and crash. Because I had PTSD already, I wasn't allowed anything in the class action.
5:15 p.m.
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
I hear what is not happening. What do you think would make it better?
5:15 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
By “make it better”, do you mean to go to the class action...?
5:15 p.m.
NDP
Rachel Blaney NDP North Island—Powell River, BC
What I mean is how VAC could be more helpful. You've indicated very clearly that they were saying, “You're already diagnosed. Good enough. That's all you get,” but you're being triggered. What would be more helpful?
I'm sorry that I have to ask these questions, but I actually need you to testify, so I can put it in the report.
5:15 p.m.
Veteran, As an Individual
As I said, it's my psychiatrist who takes care of that. I sit with him; he writes it down, and he sends reports.
What could they do? They won't do anything differently from what they do with other PTSDs. They have a special team. When the class action opened, people who were in...questioning, could call them and ask what they had...but they didn't have a clue what to say to these people.
I know I called them once, and they told me I had to reassess my PTSD, so that's why I've been, for the past two years, reassessing my PTSD condition.
5:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you very much, Ms. Laverdure.
We will now move to committee business.
Witnesses, you're welcome to stay with us if you wish. We don't have much time, but if you have to leave, that's fine. I want to take this opportunity to thank you for your testimony and your courage.
We had with us, as an individual, Dr. Alice Aiken, who is a veteran and vice-president of research and innovation at Dalhousie University; Brigitte Laverdure, who is a veteran; and earlier we welcomed Nicole Langlois, who had to leave.
With that, we will go to committee business, and the public can stay as well.
Last time, I told you that we had a motion asking two ministers to appear for two hours. After all the work of the clerk of the committee, they will appear next Tuesday at 1:00 p.m.
So we can suggest that we invite other witnesses who are veterans. The second hour would be the study of the National Memorial on Canada's Mission in Afghanistan.
Since we weren't able to respond to the motion exactly, it's up to the members of the committee to decide what to do.
I'll turn it over to Mr. Richards.
5:20 p.m.
Conservative
Blake Richards Conservative Banff—Airdrie, AB
First, I was listening to the translation and it came through as Tuesday at one o'clock. I assume that was a mistranslation.
5:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
No, no. It's not one o'clock. It is the hours of the committee, but one hour on the experience of women veterans and one hour with the two ministers.