Afghanistan Committee on April 4th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Mr. Salewicz, please go ahead.

[Stephen Salewicz]

Thank you.

I'm the director general responsible for humanitarian assistance, given the focus of our support right now on humanitarian assistance.

Canada works with a small number of very trusted partners who have a great deal of experience working in these kinds of environments. They have established measures in place to minimize the risks of misappropriation or diversion of humanitarian assistance and to make sure these emergency relief items go to the people they are intended for.

There are occasional incidents of diversion. There's no question about that. That happens in any high-risk environment. In this case it's no different, but it's not a systemic risk. It's a risk around criminality, where occasionally criminals take advantage of humanitarian activities to take some of the goods.

We get notifications about this. The systems are in place. They work. It's an unfortunate consequence of working in high-risk environments that we do get these kinds of small-scale diversions.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much.

I will continue to put questions to you, Mr. Salewicz.

There was a recent announcement of $50 million for Afghanistan and its neighbouring countries.

What do you mean by “neighbouring countries”? What specific countries are concerned, and in what way?

[Stephen Salewicz]

Mr. Chair, there are a substantial number of Afghans who have had to flee Afghanistan over the decades from conflict. I believe there are approximately 5.7 million Afghans in neighbouring countries such as Pakistan, which is a refuge to millions of Afghans. They've been there for a long time. The governments in the neighbouring countries require assistance to help sustain those populations, and we support them through the UNHCR as well as the World Food Programme.

We're also there, of course, looking for the future, should there be increased flows of populations from Afghanistan, to be in a position to support that as well.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Is that money given directly to the countries? In what form is that money given to Afghanistan's neighbouring countries? Is it simply done through the UN?

[Stephen Salewicz]

Mr. Chair, indeed that is the case. We don't use humanitarian assistance to directly fund governments. We channel the funds, the resources, through trusted partners, in this case the UNWFP and the UNHCR.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

It's good to bring it up, as this is the reason I asked the question. Thank you for answering it.

I have a slightly more delicate question to ask. Ms. Loten could answer it.

This is not my opinion, but a number of witnesses have reported that, since the western forces left, the situation on the ground has been less dangerous. As I was saying, this is a delicate question. I would ask you candidly whether it means that we should change our approach concerning the Taliban.

What is your take on that?

[Jennifer Loten]

All I can tell you is that we depend on the advice of experts on the ground and of Canadian experts.

They have told us that the situation has remained dangerous and unstable, and that it was evolving rapidly. I know that NGOs are operating, but, according to what we know and the information we are receiving from our Five Eyes partners, the situation is still dangerous and unpredictable.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

On the same topic, a few weeks ago, I read in La Presse that a Taliban delegation went to Switzerland at the invitation of an NGO and that they called on the international community to recognize the “Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan”. Those same Taliban mainly asked that humanitarian assistance needs be met in Afghanistan.

What is your department's position on this?

[Jennifer Loten]

I will ask the assistant deputy minister, Mr. Thoppil, to answer that question concerning our department's position on a geographic region. I prefer that he answer you.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I am listening to you.

[Paul Thoppil]

I thank the member for his question.

Canada has four priorities.

Our first priority is for safe passage of Afghanistan individuals to Canada. Our second is to ensure an inclusive governance within Afghanistan for all Afghans. Our third is ensuring risk mitigation to counter terrorism, and our fourth is related to efficient and timely delivery of humanitarian assistance.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you very much, Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe.

Now we will go to Madame Kwan for six minutes.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, and thank you to all the officials.

My first question is for Mr. Thoppil.

With respect to Canada's diplomatic relationship with Pakistan, one of our goals, as you just indicated, is to help Afghans get to safety, particularly those who helped serve the Canadian military, and their extended family members. We've heard from witnesses in different places that extended families are not able to get to Canada safely. Some of them have made it to Pakistan, and they are unable, for example, to get their visa or their exit visa. Those are always the reasons, it seems, as to why they cannot get to Canada safely.

What work is being done, on a diplomatic level, for Canada to work with the Pakistani government to help Afghans get to Canada safely?

[Paul Thoppil]

Mr. Chair, we have been working actively on the ground, through our diplomatic mission in Pakistan with the Pakistani officials and ministers, in terms of trying to have recognition of safe passage documents that have been provided to Afghans in order to cross such border crossings as the Torkham border gate. They have been very helpful throughout the crisis, at the height of the crisis acknowledging acceptance of certain documents, but as time has evolved, they have been a little bit more limiting in that.

Quite frankly, they have been very helpful to the extent that they can, given their large burden of hosting three million and not necessarily...acknowledging their concerns of being a draw for more.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Are you still able to do that work now? Are you still able to work with them and continue to bring Afghans to Canada?

[Paul Thoppil]

Quite frankly, given limited air routes out, there is an intermittent flow that happens through the Torkham border crossing gate between Afghanistan and Pakistan. As we acknowledge the 10,000 Afghans who came into our country...last week, since the fall of Afghanistan to the Taliban a lot of that traffic has come through the border. That is based on active discussions through officials as well as through ministerial discussions.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Is it possible to make arrangements for Canada to have evacuation flights leaving Pakistan to Canada?

[Paul Thoppil]

At this juncture, the Taliban do not support charter flights for the evacuation of Afghans. They want their Kabul airport to resume normally scheduled commercial airline traffic. Therefore, there are limits to what like-minded countries, including Canada, can do in order to initiate evacuation charter flights.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

What about evacuation charter flights from neighbouring countries?

[Paul Thoppil]

Where significant numbers have accumulated in terms of approved Afghans to be able to come to Canada, IRCC, to my knowledge, has been organizing passage for the Afghans to come. Again, I would acknowledge the 10,000 milestone that was achieved last week.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

If Afghans were able to get from Afghanistan to, let's say, Pakistan.... I know of 300 families—former Afghan interpreters' extended family members—who are trying to get to safety and are unable to do so because IRCC has not processed their application. But other witnesses at this committee have said, “Leave that to us. We will get to a third country ourselves. We'll figure out how to do it.”

If that were to happen, where IRCC actually processes the applications and provides them with the necessary documentation, would your department be able to bring in evacuation flights to bring them out to Canada safely?

[Paul Thoppil]

I believe IRCC has the requisite authorities on its own in order to entertain that response back to Afghans who have been processed to come to Canada.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Canada is providing documentation to Ukrainians urgently. Can we not do the same for Afghans?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Mr. Thoppil, you have 10 seconds.