Agriculture Committee on March 13th, 2008

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Mr. Easter, you have five minutes.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Mr. Hermanson, in response to a question from Mr. Lauzon, I believe it was, you said you serve under the Minister of Agriculture. What do you mean by that?

[Elwin Hermanson]

I mean that while I'm not a deputy minister, my title is deputy head and I am directly responsible to the Minister of Agriculture. I submit my reports to the Minister of Agriculture; he tables those reports in the Parliament of Canada. That is the structure under which the Canadian Grain Commission functions, and it has been for quite some time.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

I'm aware of the act, but are you implying that you take your direction from the minister?

[Elwin Hermanson]

In some regard. He provides us with a statement of direction.

There is another component, which we haven't talked about this morning, where we act as a quasi-judicial body. In that regard we are totally at arm's length from the minister, because in that role we are an arbitrator between producers and others in the grain handling system, or industry stakeholders themselves.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

That's one of our major concerns. I think you can see that from the questioning from the opposition.

The history of this government has been to basically undermine the independent authorities of regulatory bodies, the Canadian Wheat Board being one. They didn't like the CEO challenging them and speaking for the board, as was his responsibility, and they fired him. It was the same with the nuclear regulator--the Canadian nuclear safety commissioner. She was fired for having done her job under the legislation.

My concern is not necessarily on your qualifications, but where you will take your direction from. Will you have the independence to stand up to the minister when concerns arise? You did mention the other two commissioners, the assistant commissioner and the deputy commissioner, and I know both of those folks as well. But I also know, like you, that they've long been advocates against the Canadian Wheat Board. Their views very much parallel the minister's.

I'm concerned about the weakening role of the Canadian Grain Commission. I laid it out on the table in the beginning. I do think it was an error, and I was hoping you would say it was an error, in terms of your strong promotion of Bill C-39.

In any event, you did say to Mr. Lauzon that there were many farmers who expressed support for Bill C-39. In your role as chief commissioner, have you had any concerns expressed on the opposite side--very strong concerns--about Bill C-39 and where it might go?

I don't know whether that's in order or not, Mr. Chairman.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

I'll leave it up to the discretion of the witness. He has talked about Bill C-39 already, so I guess that door is open.

[Elwin Hermanson]

I wouldn't describe it, Mr. Easter, as strong concerns, but I would say that there is some uncertainty as to the practical results of the implementation of Bill C-39. That's an area the commission was involved in for some time prior to the tabling of this bill. In fact, that discussion and advice regarding these same issues was given to the previous government. It goes back to the 2002 independent report that was talking about the removal of some mandatory services that are currently provided by the--

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Time--

[Elwin Hermanson]

I want to get directly to your question about my role.

I have committed to uphold two values. One is that public servants will give honest and impartial advice and make all information that is relevant to a decision available to a minister. That is one of my roles as a deputy head, and I intend to give honest and impartial advice.

The second is that I will loyally implement ministerial decisions lawfully taken. That also is part of the code. And that applies to my role as the chief commissioner of the Canadian Grain Commission, but only as it pertains to the Canadian Grain Commission.

When it comes to the issue of the Canadian Wheat Board, that is not an issue we deal with, other than, as I mentioned, that the Wheat Board is a client of the Grain Commission, and we would deal with that client in the same way as we would deal with all other clients of the commission.

We don't involve ourselves in the Wheat Board issue. I understand that is an issue. Of course, from my past life, I know that's an issue. But in my role as the chief commissioner of the Canadian Grain Commission, we deal with Grain Commission issues and those alone.

As a final point, I would reiterate that the commission plays a role as a quasi-judicial body totally independent of the minister. I understand that role. At no time has there been any indication from the minister or from the government that the relationship or that role would change.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Time has expired, sir. I'll go to a third round later.

Mr. Storseth.

[Brian Storseth, Conservative, Westlock—St. Paul, AB]

Thanks very much for coming, Mr. Hermanson.

This must be a nervous time for you. Many of us who sit on this side, as you have in the past, often dream about being able to be where the rubber meets the road, in a position such as you have, so there must be many things you're looking forward to doing.

I have several questions for you. I'll start with your op-ed piece. Do you believe you've been identified with the Canadian Grain Commission now?

[Elwin Hermanson]

With regard to the op-ed piece, certainly there's been some recognition. I've been asked to represent the commission in different places as a result of that hookup. I have to be careful about what I say, but outside the realm of politics, the response has been positive. That is what we were intending and hoping for. That was the purpose of the communication.

[Brian Storseth, Conservative, Westlock—St. Paul, AB]

I can tell you that some of my producers who read the op-ed piece were very happy. It was the first time they realized you were with the Grain Commission. They recognized your name and they were very happy to see you there.

That leads to my second question. Do you believe this op-ed piece has reassured some farmers in the industry that the impacts of BillC-39 won't weaken the grain quality assurance system? I know that several of the producers in western Canada I've heard from who've read the op-ed piece were happy to see the information in the op-ed piece. Do you believe this was a success?

[Elwin Hermanson]

I think it's not complete. Obviously the bill is still under consideration. We understand that and we are prepared to carry out the Canada Grain Act, no matter what form it is in.

That being said, I wouldn't say there is either a.... Except for maybe a very few people, there isn't a cheerleading section, nor is there a naysayer section. Most producers are in between. They want the information. They generally agree with the principle of reducing their costs--and of course not too many of us would disagree with that. They are asking questions about how Bill C-39, if it is implemented, will impact this, that, or the other.

The role of the Grain Commission is to provide them with the information as best we can, and I think we do a fairly good job.

[Brian Storseth, Conservative, Westlock—St. Paul, AB]

Absolutely. In any industry you look into--and agriculture is no different--you need stability, and one of the worst things for our producers is not knowing the direction in which things are going and not knowing the issues to be highlighted that will be coming up. And I believe your op-ed piece, as well as things that followed that were written by the Grain Commission, have helped to reassure producers.

I believe it's an important role. You need to continue to get out there as the commissioner to ensure that our producers have that information and have that stability. I think it's vital, and I think you've taken some excellent first steps in your early days in this position.

How much time do I have left, Mr. Chair? I guess I'll quickly go through a couple more questions.

I don't see anything on your resumé that precludes your being an excellent commissioner of the Canadian Grain Commission. Do you see anything that does?

[Elwin Hermanson]

I had actually hoped we would talk more about that. It has come up several times, but then we've never actually gotten to the point where I could talk about my qualifications. And the clock is ticking here.

I would just say that I've had many leadership roles in the private sector, in the non-profit sector, and in the public sector. And I have a very good success rate in all three of those areas.

I guess the most successful I've been, particularly as it relates to agriculture, is that in the province of Saskatchewan an overwhelming number of people from the agriculture sector--from rural Saskatchewan, from farm communities--wanted me to be in charge of the province and be in charge of a $6-billion-plus budget that affected not only agriculture, but health care, education, the environment, justice, municipal politics, and federal-provincial relations. And they overwhelmingly asked me to take on that responsibility. That, to me, was the highest honour that could ever be bestowed upon an individual.

Somebody complained about my resumé being too short. I could have stretched it out longer if I had wanted to. I don't even know what version you have. It could be the one that's on the website, for all I know. I think I have a public record that speaks loudly enough for me. I don't feel particularly comfortable going around blowing my own horn.

[Brian Storseth, Conservative, Westlock—St. Paul, AB]

Thank you very much. I appreciate your dedication.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

We'll go to Mr. St. Amand for five minutes.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

Mr. Easter has one question.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Go ahead.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

Mr. Hermanson, you were appointed on January 21.

[Elwin Hermanson]

That's correct.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

And the op-ed piece was published on February 7.

[Elwin Hermanson]

That's correct.