Evidence of meeting #33 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was standards.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:25 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Your time has expired, Mr. Guimond.
And I want to welcome you to the committee. It's always good to have somebody here, or anybody, with agriculture experience, so welcome.
Mr. Atamanenko, five minutes.
4:25 p.m.
NDP
Alex Atamanenko NDP British Columbia Southern Interior, BC
Thank you very much to all of you for being here.
Nigel, you mentioned the linkages, and you used the example of glyphosate.
I'm wondering if our other guests might want to comment on whether there are other linkages that you feel we should be researching. Do you feel this is a direction we should be going in?
Blair, also feel free to offer your comments.
That's my first question, and maybe I'll stop there. If we have some more time I have another question, but I'd like your reaction to the glyphosate and other linkages.
4:25 p.m.
Vice-President, Saskatchewan, Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association
I'll make a few short comments and then pass it over to Blair.
I am aware of some of the studies that have been done into glyphosate. From the research I've done into it and my personal experience, the two major factors are varieties and climate. If you have a combination of adverse climate conditions, excessive moisture, lots of humidity, combined with a susceptible variety and, perhaps, an area that has had issues in the past, that's where you'll find your greatest problem.
Where I see the biggest gains going forward, and from all the research I've read into it too--I don't have anybody to quote right here--finding varieties that are resistant to it is probably the solution.
I'll hand it over to Blair.
4:25 p.m.
Blair Rutter Executive Director, Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association
The only comment I would make on the linkage to glyphosate--this is a scientific question, so it's a territory that's a little dangerous for me to tread--is that the introduction of glyphosate has certainly encouraged greater minimum tillage practices, which means a lot more crop residue straw left on the fields. Since this is a soil- and residue-based pathogen, the mere fact that farmers are now using glyphosate has certainly led to much better weed control and minimum tillage practices so we don't have the fuel costs of tillage. There are fewer passes over the field and less pesticide use. There have been tremendous advantages from using glyphosate. I think it is possible there would be a link to increased incidence of fusarium due to the increased trash left on the field.
Again, this is an area I'm not familiar with, so that's more speculative on my part than anything based on scientific study.
4:25 p.m.
NDP
Alex Atamanenko NDP British Columbia Southern Interior, BC
Thank you.
Any comments from Charlottetown or our gentlemen here?
4:25 p.m.
President, Island Grains and Protein Council
Thank you.
Yes, I had also pencilled in minimum tillage as being a real plus to greenhouse gas emission controls. At the same time, one of the practices we've always used was removing the straw off the field that had a fairly heavy fusarium infection. I suspect as well that there may be a linkage to changed tillage practices. Again, I don't have any studies to rest on, but for other disease processes in the farm, plowing was considered a way of mitigating or getting rid of some of the pathogens. There may be a link.
4:30 p.m.
NDP
Alex Atamanenko NDP British Columbia Southern Interior, BC
Would it be safe to assume that since we've adopted new practices there's more incidence of fusarium, or would we have to do some studies since we've basically stopped plowing and had minimum tillage?
4:30 p.m.
Chairman, Atlantic Grains Council
I don't think we have any evidence to back that up. I can give you a personal example. A neighbour of ours who does plow all his land that he puts into crop has the same problem as we do on our farm, where we use minimal tillage. This was only his second year growing wheat and his problem was as severe as ours. There may well be a linkage, but at the same time we've been encouraged to do minimum tillage in particular in this part of the country to reduce erosion and stuff like that.
We feel as producers that we're using a lot better tillage practice today than we were ten years ago, for example. But there may well be a linkage; there may well be.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Thank you.
Your time has expired, Mr. Atamanenko.
We'll move to Mr. Hoback for five minutes.
October 20th, 2009 / 4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Welcome, everybody. It's good to see you all here.
I have some friends in this room, of course.
Allan, it's good to see you again. I haven't seen you for a couple of years. You're looking good.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Nigel, I see it's your first time here. Welcome. Just relax, take your time; you'll do well.
My first question is actually for you, Derek. Have the standards changed on fusarium this last year? There've been no changes, as far as I know.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay. From the contract that you have, to the handling agent, whether it be the grain company or directly to the farmers, there's been no change in the contract this last year that says you need to have a different tolerance level on fusarium?
4:30 p.m.
Vice-President, P & H Milling Group
No, we haven't changed our practices at all. We still follow the voluntary standards we established for ourselves based on the standards that exist for soft wheat.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay. So on hard red wheat, there are no standards as far as we know?
4:30 p.m.
Vice-President, P & H Milling Group
There are no standards or regulations. We have one internally.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Okay.
Do you enforce that internal standard in your contracts that go out to the producers?
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
How do you communicate that to the producers so they know when they're growing that crop to deliver to you that they have these standards to meet that aren't necessarily in the act?
4:30 p.m.
Vice-President, P & H Milling Group
I guess the simplest way for me to answer is that most of my experience is in Ontario. We have three mills in Ontario, and that's where I'm based.
Fusarium is not a new issue in Ontario. I'm sure the chairman is well aware of fusarium challenges in Ontario for 20 years or so. So it's recognized by the grain trade industry, and those standards, even though they're voluntary, are also recognized. They're written into our contracts. It's handled that way.
If I could, quickly, I just want to support the comment earlier about varietal development. Anecdotally, looking at Ontario, new varieties have made a huge difference in reducing the financial impact on farmers by fusarium, compared to, say, 15 years ago.
4:30 p.m.
Conservative
Randy Hoback Conservative Prince Albert, SK
I think a lot of people would agree with you on that, Derek.
I want to focus again on the process. That's where I'm going in my questioning here as we look at some of the other microtoxins that possibly could be an issue and as we look at whether we should or shouldn't have regulations and what those levels should be.
Gordon, do you have a process in mind? You have to keep in mind that it's not just the miller, but also the grain-handling company. It could be the railcar, or it could be the farmer. We're not 100% sure where we're seeing the breakdown on infection.
4:30 p.m.
President, Canadian National Millers Association, P & H Milling Group
We do have processes in mind, and the processes are happening on several fronts.
The Canada Grains Council has a working group. It's a whole value-chain working group that includes producer organizations, handling and transportation, and the milling industry. ANAC is also a member of the Canada Grains Council.
We are hoping to provide, within a six-week timeframe, basic facts into CFIA's working group—which meets for the first time next Monday—on what we have in place today along the whole supply chain, what is being used today, what tools are available today, and what additional measures might we all possibly take in the short term to deal with this. That's one process.
CFIA has a process that is attempting to develop more information around where we are at risk: incidence geographically, levels, etc. They'll speak to that, I'm sure.
The third process is a new one. It is an industry-government working group that is modelled after one that has assisted Environment Canada in its regulatory responsibilities for many years. It is a very comprehensive working group. It will probably have 36 members on it and will take a whole supply chain approach. We're glad that it has been accepted. We've recommended timelines of about 18 to 21 months. That's very tight for all the work that needs to be done, but I think we'll all know a great deal more.
Our whole thrust, in all our communications to Health Canada and CFIA and ministers over the last 14 months, has been that we have to get this right and get it right the first time, and we have repeatedly identified the need to avoid punitive and unreasonable costs to farmers.