Agriculture Committee on Oct. 2nd, 2018

[Eva Nassif, Liberal, Vimy, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Desrosiers.

Is there anything you would like to add, Mr. Beauregard?

[René Beauregard]

As I was saying earlier, the best way to encourage farmers to get help is to make them understand that getting help is not a bad thing. There could be a program to encourage farmers to get help from the health care system when possible but also from workers who are there for them, such as those at Au coeur des familles agricoles or other organizations in other parts of the country. I think that is important.

For the past two years, Quebec's agricultural producers' union, UPA, has been talking a lot about farmers' psychological distress and trying to find solutions. That means that the people who come looking for help are less and less ashamed to do so. Instead, they are seeing it as a positive thing.

The federal government would do well to look at what could be done to further encourage farmers to get help. It could offer farmers in other provinces services similar to the ones we offer. I have seen the positive impact that our work has had in Quebec. We do not have workers in every region, but we should, because there are agricultural communities everywhere.

Year after year, we struggle to find funding so that our organization can continue its operations and continue to grow. In the past, we wanted to expand our services to offer them in every region. Now, people in various regions are calling us. They are aware of their difficulties and are unable to find the proper resources to respond to those needs in their communities.

What can we do to meet those needs? Should the government create a financial support program for workers who take training specifically designed to help farmers? That is what is being done in Quebec. Suicide sentinels have been trained in co-operation with the UPA and the Association québécoise de prévention du suicide so that there is a program designed especially for farmers. The government could implement support services, similar to the ones we have, for farmers across the county.

[Eva Nassif, Liberal, Vimy, QC]

Thank you.

According to a 30-year-old study on suicide among Canadian farmers, suicide rates are twice as high among Quebec farmers as in the general population.

Do you think that's still the case? We don't have any recent studies. These figures are 30 years old.

[René Beauregard]

It's hard to say. We don't have access to those figures. With respect to suicide, however, I can tell you that, in the vast majority of cases, people who seek our organization's help aren't suicidal. There may be a lot of suicides in the farming sector, but there's a lot more distress than suicide as such. Suicide is final, but the fact remains that 95% of people who consult our organization aren't suicidal: they're distressed.

We have to pay special attention to people who are going to commit the irreversible act of suicide. It's very important to find solutions to prevent them from doing so. However, the vast majority of farmers aren't quite there. They're the ones we have to support and see on a proactive and preventive basis, precisely so they don't go as far as suicide. Both actions are important: we don't want these people to reach the point of suicide, and we have to do all we can to make sure they don't.

[Eva Nassif, Liberal, Vimy, QC]

Ms. Langevin, what do you think are the essential elements of a mental health strategy to reduce the suicide rate among farmers?

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

We unfortunately can't address that question, but we may be able to do so later on.

Mr. Shipley, you have six minutes.

[Bev Shipley, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, CPC]

Thank you very much for being a part of our discussion.

Nancy, I want to say thank you to you.

In terms of the intervenors—and Mr. Beauregard, you talked about that also—there were 1,157 interventions, and you have five intervenors.

How did you get trained? What took you to being part of what you call “the milk run”? I also have a question about that. How did it get started that you just make cold calls to farms?

[Nancy Langevin]

"Milk runs" are really for preventive purposes. People who experience psychological distress or, ultimately, who have suicidal ideas don't sit on committees, don't belong to the UPA or its executive and have no municipal role to play. They are very isolated people. We talked about them earlier. The purpose of "milk runs" is to reach the most vulnerable individuals.

I've come up with a way of doing this since I don't have a list that tells me where farmers live on a range. I say I go to an RCM and go up and down the range. I don't stop at every place since farmers talk to each other. I stop to introduce myself and so on. That's how things started. We want to reach the people we don't see.

[Bev Shipley]

You talked about training for intervenors. How does that happen? Who does the training? Who should be doing the training? What would be the qualifiers to have an intervenor trained?

[René Beauregard]

When we say training, we mean academic training. These people have bachelor's degrees in social work or college diplomas in the field. Their basic training as intervenors is based on that. Agricultural training—

[Bev Shipley]

I'm talking about an intervenor like Nancy.

[René Beauregard]

Yes.

[Bev Shipley]

Professional psychologists have their role, but two other components are really critical. One is because Nancy and those like her come alongside somebody and give them hope. That's one of the key ingredients, I believe.

As for the second part, is there someone who comes along and puts together some financial support by collecting the information of creditors, and then an understanding person sits with these individuals to help? Is there someone to talk to about that when you find yourself closed in?

You talked about the financial stress, and I would suggest that yesterday is going to be an additional stress added to much of the farming community. How do we deal with it? I was told back in the 1980s that what happens is you can't think straight. You just can't pull it all apart to categorize the issues you need to prioritize to look at your financial situation. Is there a financial component to this assistance?

[René Beauregard]

Do you mean financial assistance that would be provided to farmers?

[Bev Shipley]

Yes.

[René Beauregard]

Do you mean financial assistance to obtain services from Au coeur des familles agricoles?

[Bev Shipley]

I mean both.

[René Beauregard]

Our services are free of charge, and we provide them across the province. When a farmer comes to see us, support services from intervenors like Ms. Langevin, both respite and accommodation services, are provided free of charge. That's why this isn't a factor that prevents people from seeking help. So regardless of the size of the farm business, whether it's small or very large, it costs nothing to come and get help from us.

There are probably provincial programs to meet similar needs among people experiencing financial problems on the farm, who need outside help in trying to get back on track.

As odd as it may seem, when farmers come to us for help, even if they have financial problems, that's not what they mainly talk about. It's one factor among many. Consequently, our services aren't based solely on financial problems.

I hope that answers your question.

[Bev Shipley]

Are you finding that addictions because of the anxiety become an issue in any of the cases you deal with?

[Nancy Langevin]

I can't say whether there are more substance abuse problems, but they do exist. As was said, they stay in one single place. It's easier for them because they don't have to drive their vehicles.

People with alcohol problems start drinking early in the morning, whereas people who have drinking problems but work outside the home figure they'll open the bottle when they get home from work. However, farmers start drinking early in the day.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Unfortunately, that's all the time we have for this first hour of testimony.

Mr. Beauregard, Ms. Langevin and Ms. Desrosiers, thank you for appearing before us this morning to tell us about a very important topic for our farmers.

We will now suspend for a few minutes and then hear from the second panel of witnesses.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

We will recommence.

With us today, we have, as an individual farmer, Mr. Sean Stanford. Thank you for being here, Mr. Stanford.

We also have, from LPG Farms, Mehgin Reynolds, Owner-Operator. Welcome.

We have been informed that Mr. Stéphane Bisaillon will probably be late. We will assign him his seat when he arrives.

To start, Mr. Stanford, you can present your opening statement for up to six minutes. Thank you.

[Sean Stanford, Farmer, As an Individual]

Hi, everybody. My name is Sean Stanford. I'm a 34-year-old grain farmer from southern Alberta. I farm there with my wife and our two young children.

I'd like to begin by telling you that I'm not weak and I'm not any less of a man; I'm just a little sick. I suffer from anxiety, depression and post-traumatic stress disorder. I was diagnosed nearly two years ago and have been on multiple medications and seen multiple therapists to help me with my conditions.

While I may not be different from many Canadians, the industry that I work in makes these conditions a bit harder to deal with. There are actually many extra challenges that farmers and producers have to deal with that the general population does not.

Farming is one of the few occupations that are highly dependent on weather. As you're well aware, no one can control the weather. I can tell you it is quite stressful to know that the biggest factor in your paycheque for the year is out of your hands. There are many farmers back home who have not finished harvest yet, and it is covered with snow. After a very, very dry summer and now a wet fall, emotions are running quite high.

Farmers also spend many hours and days isolated on their land. I myself have gone days on end without seeing another person for the entire day. This gives your mind too much time to play tricks on you. It gives you too much time to second-guess yourself and think about whether or not you're making the right decisions for your business. It does not give you an opportunity to think about what's actually happening in the real world back home. You can get lonely out there and miss your family. Isolation also means less access to professional help such as doctors, counsellors and psychologists. All three of these professions are integral to the proper recovery of someone suffering from mental health conditions.

Experts say that multiple elements are required to keep a person healthy. Included in those are proper exercise, nutrition, relaxation time and sleep. I can personally tell you that it is nearly impossible to get all these elements in as a farmer during the busy season. Working 100 hours or more per week is not abnormal. Having a meal that does not come out of a lunch box is also uncommon. Have you ever tried to do jumping jacks in a tractor? It's not that easy.

Here are the big questions: what resources are available, and what is missing?

Rural Canada has been shrinking. Our local hospital and doctor's office closed up many years ago. For any counselling or therapy, I need to travel about 30 miles. I know that it's a lot longer and further for many others. Then to actually get an appointment with some of these professionals, the wait can be many weeks. This is unacceptable. The cost of these services is also quite high. We need better and cheaper access to these health professionals.

I had my first interaction with the counsellor through my local fire department. I have volunteered there for 14 years, and that's where my PTSD stems from. When I asked my fire chief to find me some help, there was already a set of resources lined up to help me. Emergency services seem to have the proper channels in place already. As far as I know, there are no dedicated resources like these in place for farmers and agricultural producers.

Many of the medications used to treat anxiety and depression can be quite expensive as well. Thankfully, I am able to afford Blue Cross coverage for my family, but this does not cover some of the medications required or prescribed. These medications need to be more affordable for everybody.

I have learned a lot and made many connections using social media and the Internet. Twitter has been a huge help for me to find many resources, links and friends to help me through the tough times. Proper cellular service in rural Canada is essential for this reason. Contact with the outside world when you're isolated is more possible, so the use of smart phones and mobile Internet has been a huge help for me.

What else are we missing? What else haven't we thought of yet? Special conditions for ag producers may call for special solutions. Maybe a mental health app of some kind for smart phones to help diagnose issues or provide ideas to help out during rough periods would be useful. Perhaps teleconferencing or video conferencing with a therapist may help. Trying to stomp out the stigma of having a mental health condition is a huge hurdle to overcome, especially in agriculture.

Many people, including me, feel like mental health issues should be something individuals should be able to handle themselves. Some producers have tried to beat down these walls of stigma and have faced a barrage of bullying and personal attacks for it, myself included. We need to come up with a way to tell people they are also sick and need proper treatment. It's no different from having a cold or a cut on your hand. We need to end the stigma.

I hope this has given you some insight into my personal thoughts on mental health issues in agriculture. Thank you for having me here today.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Mr. Stanford.

Now we'll have Ms. Reynolds for six minutes.

[Mehgin Reynolds, Owner Operator, LPG Farms]

I grew up in Calgary, Alberta, and had an 11-year career in the film industry before meeting my husband and moving to rural Saskatchewan. There, I became a grain farmer. It didn't take me long to figure out how challenging, stressful and isolating farming can be.

While 2016 may have been my fourth crop year, it was the first time I stood and watched while my crop, worth literally hundreds of thousands of dollars, was destroyed in a 10-minute hail storm. It was also the first time in my life that I felt like a complete failure—a failure as a farmer, a failure as a spouse and a failure as a provider for my family. It was the first time, and sadly not the last, that I felt my only worth to my family was in my life insurance policy.

I would love to sit here in front of you all today and say that things are better and that I'm the only one in Canadian agriculture who has ever felt this way. To do so would be a lie. We are now struggling for our third year in a row. Weather extremes sabotage our ability to grow the bushels we need to make a profit. Commodity prices do not come close to covering our expenses. Transportation issues inhibit our ability to pay our bills on time. I no longer know what it feels like to live without stress. My husband now struggles with anxiety triggered by the stress of trying to farm and make ends meet. I have watched this anxiety bring him sobbing to his knees.

If you ask me in this moment if I hope my girls grow up wanting to take over our fourth-generation farm, I would tell you that I would encourage them to do anything but become farmers. However, the stark reality is that if we continue down this path, there will not be a farm for them to take over one day.

Right now I'm sure you're thinking that we must be bad farmers and that there must be something wrong with our business plan. After all, the point of a business is balancing risk while trying to make a profit. Do you know that grain farmers in Canada have the second-highest cost of inputs? That is the seed, seed treatment, fertilizer and chemicals we need to grow our crops. We also cannot come close to growing the bushels that other countries grow, thanks to our short growing season and dry climate. On an average year, the bushels I am able to produce on my fields do not cover my expenses, including my mortgage and land rent.

I need to work off-farm, not only to put food on my family's table but to also subsidize my farm expenses. If I worked as a teacher, nurse or banker, or if I were still working in the film industry, I would not be required to hold a second job to afford to do my first.

You see, I cannot raise the price I sell my crops for in order to help cover the rising expenses associated with growing my crops. When I need to move grain to pay bills, I try to find the best contract possible, but ultimately I have very little control over the price. I'm usually forced to sell at a time when prices are low from harvest pressure in order to cover bills that have been accumulating over the year. If a carbon tax is forced upon me, I stand to add an additional $30,000 to my expense list as well.

In February, I sat in a room full of 400 producers. We were tasked with standing up when a question asked applied to us. The first question was, “Have you ever lost a family member or friend to suicide?” Ninety per cent of the room stood up, and that broke my heart.

Farmers are struggling, not only in Canada but globally. We're struggling with high levels of stress, anxiety and depression. We cannot speak out or admit we are struggling because we are told to be strong. We are told to suck it up. We are told that we are not real farmers if we ask for help. If we seek treatment, we might be turned down for life insurance policies or watch our premiums skyrocket. Life insurance companies classify us as higher risk when we take care of our ourselves and seek help.

We run on three to five hours of sleep during the busy seasons—that is, seeding and harvest—and go for weeks without seeing much of our families and children. We spend 15-plus hours a day in equipment cabs by ourselves.

In isolation, we are running the numbers, worrying about our bills and getting further into our own heads. Sometimes we have our children with us as well. We have to juggle farming because we don't have access to child care. Often we are also volunteers in our communities as first responders who deal with being on scene for accidents and with the deaths of our friends and community members.

This summer, a friend posted that a farmer in her community had just died from suicide. I did not know the person, but I broke down sobbing at my kitchen table. When I took a moment to reflect on why the death of someone I did not know upset me so much, I was forced to bring light to a fear that I do not want to dwell on: the fear that surges up when I cannot get ahold of my husband. It is the fear that, just possibly, he has given in to the non-stop stress and anxiety of trying to provide for our family and farm.

The conversation is starting to change. Producers are starting to open up, but it is only a start. The stigma surrounding mental health in agriculture is still strong. We need support from each other, support from our communities, and we need services from our health care systems. Most importantly, we need to be able to afford to farm without having to work off the farm.

Thank you for your time. I appreciate the opportunity to be here to talk with you today.