Agriculture Committee on Nov. 24th, 2016

[Marie-Ève Levert]

Another way we can build market and market access in other countries is by having the equivalency arrangement. Currently we have equivalency arrangements with the U.S., Europe, Japan, Switzerland, and Costa Rica, which allows us to have access to 90% of the global demand for organic. It means that our government added the system abroad. With negotiations and with side-by-side analysis of their standards, they are deemed equivalent. We vouch for the system in their country. That's why ingredients or processed products that are coming from each country are deemed equivalent. That helps trade as well. It helps growers and processors in each country by not adding the burden of another cost for certification to other countries' standards.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Within the standards and the equivalencies, the standards within Canada and certifications within Canada, at one point there were a lot of groups that were certifying, but weren't certified as a body. Have we standardized our certification network?

[Marie-Ève Levert]

Yes, we did standardize our certification in 2009. We now have a Canadian organic standard at a national level.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Our government has just ratified the CETA agreement. I'm wondering about the opportunities under the Calgary statement, which talks about markets and trade. Looking at the opportunities, we are undersupplied by organic right now. CETA might help with that. The European market is more developed for organics, I'm thinking, and we may learn something from that. We might be able to export into that market.

What's the net effect of CETA on organics?

[Marie-Ève Levert]

We are already exporting to Europe. We've been exporting there since we had equivalency with them. We signed our equivalency agreement in 2011. CETA will reduce the tariff barrier, but if we look at both countries, I think the main difference is the investment that their governments are making in maintaining good standards, and also in promoting organic in their own countries. They're investing more than we do, so it could be a competitive disadvantage.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Is that something you could supply us through the clerk, the advantage that Europe has in funding organics relative to Canada? Once we start doing more trade, that might be a competitiveness disadvantage that we'd have to overcome.

[Marie-Ève Levert]

Yes. Absolutely.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

That's terrific. Thank you.

[Marie-Ève Levert]

My colleague wants to add something.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Okay, but very briefly.

[Andrew Hammermeister]

It's a competitive advantage in science as well. They invest a lot more money in science there as well as supporting organic agriculture.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Right, thank you, and it's good to have Dalhousie here. I know that the University of Guelph and Dalhousie University do a lot of things together, especially in organics, so thank you for coming.

We have a group called FarmStart in Guelph that looks at how we help young people get involved in farming. I was involved with setting up an incubator centre for business in Guelph. I'm wondering if there is an equivalent in terms of land sharing so that young farmers could try a smaller plot of land. They couldn't afford the land, but could farm the land with a whole group of people. Are there incubator farms out there?

[Paul Glenn]

I'm sure there are. I don't know the specifics on them.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

It seems like an opportunity.

[Paul Glenn]

Absolutely, that would be a tremendous opportunity, especially for new entrants to learn the business model basically and get their feet wet, and then build from there.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Great, thanks.

In that vein, I know co-ops are working on transition planning through the co-op movement. Do you have any type of relationship with co-ops, or are you using co-ops as a model?

[Guenette Bautz]

No, we're not currently working directly with co-ops, and it's not that there aren't a lot of opportunities for us to work with them. We are a single-staff organization with only 70% time and limited resources and funding.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

They may be able to help with some of the research because of the research the international co-op movement is doing around transition and looking at non-standard....

I'm trying to fish out what we could work on through this policy framework. A lot of this is provincial in terms of high schools and specialist high-skills majors we have in Guelph who teach young high school students the opportunities around farming.

Precision farming has to be something that you're focused on, I'm guessing. Is there some way of helping the federal government to bridge to provincial governments with programs such as promoting precision farming within the education system in high schools or universities?

[Paul Glenn]

If there could be funding earmarked specifically for young farmer programs at the provincial level, that would be great. I know it's tough for some of our young farmer organizations to get funding from the provincial governments, and sometimes they do have other programs that are created but aren't necessarily linked, or don't focus on young farmers specifically.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Thank you both.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Mr. Glenn.

Mr. Shipley, we're in between, but anyway, I'll give you time.

[Bev Shipley, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you very much.

It's good to see everyone.

I'm glad somebody touched on succession planning and the complexities with children. In the transfers, regardless, it's just a very difficult situation that everyone goes through, particularly with the number of transfers that are going to be happening over the next decade or so. One person told me that fair is not always equal, and when you get to the transfer of farms with a number of children, that's likely true.

I want to touch a bit on the access to capital for young farmers. We see the Farm Credit Corporation as a major lender. I'm quite honestly concerned with the amount of debt load, regardless of whether you're organic or conventional, in the agriculture industry.

I wonder if you have some thoughts, quickly, of what we might consider for the long term in terms of the sustainability of agriculture. Should there be a change in markets and/or interest rates?

Paul, I'll start with you, and then I'll go to Tia.

[Paul Glenn]

Yes, access to land is a big one, because the price of land is up so much, so then the capital to buy the land is obviously more difficult. If there is competition from outside Canada to buy that land, that's also a great risk to compete with them. But access to capital is a huge issue.

There is some good programming now from Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada for young farmers. I believe there is a $400,000 loan for capital land investments, so that's great. It's not a one-size-fits-all program, so maybe if there is some flexibility in that program, or extra programs for the supply management sector, that could be very beneficial.

[Tia Loftsgard]

An idea that I've heard thrown around a few times is land trusts and actually creating a program that would allow older farmers to bring in younger farmers on their land and transition the land slowly through a payment plan. I think that's an idea that needs to be explored further—removing any economic or income tax hurdles, etc., to create a program such as that.

Another thing in regard to debt is co-ops. I've seen young farmers. They love to pool together and spread the risk. I think that if there were a co-op incentive program for young farmers to come together to do collective buying of land or to reduce the risk and spread it through a co-op and land trust system, we would be able to create some innovative programming.

The great thing about co-ops is that there is an infrastructure there. There are 4-H clubs. I think all of this could be brought together for conventional and organic farmers.

[Bev Shipley, Conservative, Lambton—Kent—Middlesex, ON]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Chair, do I have any time left?