Agriculture Committee on May 16th, 2017

[Ruth Ellen Brosseau, NDP, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

I have just another quick question. On the transfer of family farms, there was a private member's bill before the House recently. Sadly, it was voted down mainly because the Liberal Party didn't see—

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Unfortunately, Ms. Brosseau, your time is up.

Mr. Peschisolido, you have six minutes.

[Joe Peschisolido, Liberal, Steveston—Richmond East, BC]

Thank you, Minister, for appearing here.

As you know, my riding is Steveston—Richmond East, just south of Vancouver. We deal with the agricultural issues in all the Lower Mainland. Just like you, I'm a big advocate of creating a strong, robust agricultural sector in B.C.

Also, as you recall, you came out to the Hoegler's farm and did a tour of a 200-acre farm in the middle of Richmond. We had about 200 farmers from the whole area, and they were intrigued not only by the rides and the tour we did but by your conversations with them. You talked to them about how we can build a strong agricultural sector in B.C.

Earlier on you mentioned that you had conversations on the framework policy with your provincial counterparts. I know you discussed it overall with Mr. Longfield, but can you talk a little about how things are progressing as it relates to B.C.?

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

I can talk to you about how it's progressing, but as I said before, a lot of different provincial ministers are involved with it, and I cannot state the framework we're working on. There's no announcement yet.

We tried to make sure...like what I saw when I was out in your riding. That kind of thing brings in a lot of dollars: very successful small operations that produce fresh food for communities. That kind of thing is more than excellent. That and many other things is what we're trying to make sure we put together.

The business risk management part is very important, in my opinion. I think the ministers agreed that it is, and hopefully we can deal with that in an appropriate manner.

It's also important to note—and I just want to emphasize for the committee and anybody who is listening—that there are a lot more dollars beyond the national policy framework. Farmers are innovative. I've farmed all my life. You have to make it work. If anybody can make it work it's a farmer because you have to be a lot of different things: a bit of a mechanic, a bit of a welder, and a bit of a veterinarian. These dollars are there to make sure that the agricultural sector is more innovative, that there's more clean technology. All this stuff is so important.

Then there are the superclusters to make sure we're able to capture the worldwide opportunities. I had the privilege of being in Vietnam, India, and China. The demand for food is immense and is growing by about 7% per year in these countries. They want the good food you had for breakfast today, and it's our job to produce it.

The policy framework and the last budget were put together to help do that. It's important that farmers realize that both are there to make sure we work together. It's not just through my department; it's an all-of-government program. I'm sure the agricultural sector will do very well on this.

[Joe Peschisolido, Liberal, Steveston—Richmond East, BC]

Minister, you mentioned India, Vietnam, and China. As you recall from your visit, a lot of Canadian farmers of Chinese, South Asian, and Vietnamese background were there that day. We discussed how to export to Asia, and that's very important for all of Canada but in particular for B.C. I'd like to thank you for putting emphasis on creating federal slaughterhouses so we can start sending our beef and other products to Asia.

Can you elaborate a little more on your conversations with the officials in China, Vietnam, and India so our farmers in B.C. as well as all across the country can prepare themselves for having a new market available to us?

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

I'll give you one example, on pulses. Ninety per cent of the pulses we produce in this country are exported to the Asian market. They're grown now, I think, right across the country. That's just one fine example. There's no question about beef and pork and many, many other products that they want. We had shellfish. There's no end to it. For canola we have also established a deal with China to 2020, which is vitally important. It's always hard to work these deals out, but my understanding is that we export more canola now than we ever did, so it's interesting. It's also vitally important to the agricultural sector. Really, it's the whole of agriculture that has the opportunity. There might be some things we produce that they don't use in a certain area, but for most of what we produce in agriculture, there is an opening somewhere in the world.

[Joe Peschisolido, Liberal, Steveston—Richmond East, BC]

You mentioned earlier the crop logistics working group. Can you elaborate on why it's been reinstated and some of the benefits to that?

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

We have to make sure the farmers understand exactly what's going on. I'm able to sit down with the farmers and hear first-hand from them. We also need to know, in the grain industry, how the shipments are going and what's available. This is what this is all about, making sure that farmers—and that we as a government and you as a committee—are fully aware of what the problems are and basically what direction we need to go in, and what programs we have.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Minister.

Ms. Lockhart.

Sorry, I want to manage it so that I get to go around, so we're going to reduce it to four minutes at this stage.

[Alaina Lockhart, Liberal, Fundy Royal, NB]

Very good, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, and thank you to the officials who are here today.

As a former human resources professional and a business owner and as an Atlantic Canadian, I'm sensitive to our workforce. We're all very excited to see the goal of $75 billion in exports for agriculture and to talk about innovation and the opportunities that are there and the whole-of-government approach to that outside of just agriculture. I'm just wondering if you can talk to us about workforce and any work you're doing with other departments to solidify our workforce going forward, for producers and for processing as well.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Without question, no matter what area you talk about—and I don't know if you're referring to the foreign worker program, but that's certainly one that was of great interest to me. I know we had difficulties with the foreign worker program, but it's an essential program in many areas of the country. My view is that if you have the product and you have the manufacturing capacity, but you do not have the people, it's important that we as a government make sure that we have the people there to do that. I can assure you that I work closely with Employment and Social Development Canada.

I can tell you that for the people I represent, it's okay to say there are people on EI and this type of thing, but if there's a plant that hires 150 foreign workers and 250 or 300 local workers, if we do not have the foreign workers, we do not have the local workers. The process will move somewhere else, perhaps to the state of Maine or something. What we have to do—and I'm a big advocate of this—is to make sure as much as we can that if there are problems with the program, we repair the problems and make sure that the workers are there. It's so important, and I appreciate the question.

[Alaina Lockhart, Liberal, Fundy Royal, NB]

I think you bring up a good point. When we look at the issue of foreign workers and try to balance that against those who are having difficulty finding employment, we have to look at how they solidify some of those employers, which actually results in more jobs for local workers.

Also, we've talked about succession planning, and we've talked about youth, and engaging youth. I wonder if you could elaborate for us on the agricultural youth green jobs initiative, what that is, and how you see that being of benefit.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Well, basically, on the farmers' side, the youth green jobs initiative gives young people an opportunity to get a job, let's say, on a farm. It's an environmental occupation, but it's also an agricultural occupation. What this does is give young people the opportunity to work and have some experience on the farm. One of the biggest questions is—everybody around this table here knows this—where have you worked before? For people with no work experience, this initiative gives them the opportunity to work in what is becoming one of the most important industries in our country: agriculture and agrifood. It's vitally important on both sides. We need to make sure that the people who are interested.... There are so many areas of agriculture you can be in. On the processing side, it's great to ship vessel loads of products, but I'd rather ship them in 10-ounce packages because it brings more dollars to the area, and we work on that as best we can. These are the ways we talk about innovation dollars and this type of thing. The innovators can use the dollars that are available in Navdeep Bains' budget and other budgets to make sure that their plants are able to produce this product. I'm not big on sending something somewhere else to be repackaged. It happens, and it will happen—

[Alaina Lockhart, Liberal, Fundy Royal, NB]

Yes.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

—but we need the benefit in this country.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you.

Mr. Gourde, you have four minutes.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for being here, Mr. Minister.

One of the major challenges for future generations, in terms of farm transfers, is the increase in the price of land. Transfer models must be progressive and very imaginative. Land is worth more and more when it is transferred. So there is a huge financial impact, and the burden of debt falls on future generations of farmers who are going to be spending a part of their lives paying interest to banks rather than profiting from the fruits of their labour.

Do you have a plan to help these future farmers, Mr. Minister?

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Well, it's a problem, without any question. Government just cannot give young people the money to buy a farm. I don't think you will see that take place, but what we did do with Farm Credit was increase the loan application for young farmers from half a million dollars to $1 million, which helps. However, there are an awful lot of other.... There are other ways in the tax system. I'm always supportive of any way you can have a tax system to improve the possibility. The fact is that agricultural land is valuable and becoming more valuable. That's simply the way it is. I don't think we're in a position where we're going to be able to.... Succession is a big problem. Do I have the answers to how somebody can buy a multi-million dollar farm, and do we give them the money? No, the government will not be handing over farms to young people, but we are doing everything possible to try to make sure, through the tax system, that it is more possible for young people to enter the agricultural sector.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

You talked about the government’s major investment in railway infrastructure to help grain producers export their products. However, a part of the problem at the moment is competition on the railways from cars carrying oil. Has the government thrown in the towel on pipeline construction that might have allowed grain to be transported by rail? It will be a major challenge to build new rail lines. The environmental aspect also has to be considered: rail lines are very visible, unlike pipelines, which are underground, and which we do not see it all.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Well, of course, I'm not in the transportation of oil. That's not my sector. There are pipelines, and we support pipelines, as long as they are done in an appropriate manner. However, the rail lines are vitally important. We know that a number of years ago there was a study done after there was a major problem with a grain shipment on the Prairies. What that did was bring up what was presented today in the House, which I think is vitally important. I was a farmer. I grew potatoes on Prince Edward Island. Back then, we did have a railway. If I ordered a car, I had to load the car. If I had a problem and couldn't load that car, I paid to merge. If that car did not come, tough luck, I got nothing.

A lot of things happened. One thing that happened that I never thought I would see as minister of agriculture and agrifood was reciprocal penalties put in place. I think that's very important for the agricultural sector because there has to be...if it's a problem for you as a farmer, it should also be a problem for the provider. That's one of the things. Interswitching.... There are a number of things that are vitally important to make sure that we have the proper rail system in place to move the product, and not just the product we have today. It has to be done in a way that we can move the product in four or five years' time because it's going to increase. We're making investments in the agricultural sector in order to make sure there is more product produced in the same amount of land, which means more demand for the transportation system.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Mr. MacAulay.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

We have to have a transportation system in place that can provide this service because it's absolutely no good to produce the product if you cannot provide it to your customer, and many times it has to be provided in a timely fashion. If you do not provide it in a timely fashion, somebody else will. I want to make sure the Canadian farmer can do that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

Mr. Breton, you have the floor for four minutes.

[Pierre Breton, Liberal, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My thanks also to the minister for joining us. It is greatly appreciated.

I am especially proud that agriculture is one of the six sectors identified in the government’s new plan for our economy. In my opinion, an increase in exports to $75 billion by 2025 is an extremely commendable objective.

Farmers and processors in my constituency are quite proud that our government is putting a number of measures in place. The region has maple syrup producers. That is a highly active sector, actually, like pork and fruit juice production. Everything revolves around production, because the land is not going to get any bigger. So it will be difficult to expand manufacturing plants or factories.

Producers want to be part of this economic plan. If you had two or three proposals to help our farmers and processors, what would they be? It is extremely important for them because they want to make the most out of the possibilities that exist. They have quality products to offer and they want the world to enjoy those products.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

It's interesting to go around the world. Your maple syrup is a quality product. It makes you proud when you go around the world. Everybody loves maple syrup. I don't have the exact figures, but I'm sure you can produce an awful lot more maple syrup and have absolutely no problem selling it. Without question, I think it sells itself.

But everything does not sell itself. What you have to do is make sure that you.... And I think face to face with governments is very important. I think rapport, number one, is vitally important. I think it's important to have a rapport with different governments. Then it's important that you have a rapport with the importers. I'm talking more about the Asian market, and we're working hard in that area. That's what we're trying to do.

We have trade missions there, and without question, maple syrup is always brought up. The last time I was there, I saw some beautiful market lobsters. We opened a trade fair with the minister of agriculture in China. That all helps because you get media and you get the different products in this country presented in the way the Chinese, the Indians, or the Vietnamese want. That's what you have to be able to provide. That's what we're working on.

It's fair to say governments over the years have been working hard on this, but the opportunity is there now, and we must make sure we take advantage of that. I think it's fair to say we are. We have the products.

Our regulatory process was mentioned here previously. Our regulatory process is vitally important because, no matter what happens, when you sell something in a foreign country and have a problem.... You will always have problems. We are a science-based regulatory system. If you have a science-based system, and you have to send somebody to wherever it might be...it's much easier to resolve the issue.

It's also true that most countries from around the world appreciate—sometimes they don't always accept—our science-based system. That's something we need to have. You talk about trust, a social licence. All these things are so important in the Asian community, but, of course, our biggest partner is the United States of America. We have to make sure we maintain that market. They are our best friends and our biggest market, and we will continue to work very hard with them.

That's basically where we are, Mr. Breton, with promoting.

I think it's also fair to say that, with CETA, that's going to be $1.5 billion a year right there. These kinds of agreements are so important, and other countries are looking at these kinds of agreements that we're able to sign.

You saw what NAFTA did. It increased the sale of agriculture by four times here in this country. These things are amazing.