Agriculture Committee on Nov. 24th, 2020

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

You talked about your application, which seemed complicated. Is it perhaps the form that is complicated?

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Unfortunately, Mr. Perron, that was all the time you had.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Has it run out already? We did lose a lot of time at the beginning.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

We reset the timer, so you did get your six minutes.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Okay, thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you.

We will now move to Mr. MacGregor for six minutes.

Go ahead, Mr. MacGregor.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you so much, Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Lewis, for your words, and thank you, Ms. Stafford, for appearing on behalf of the Cowichan Green Community. I know your organization quite well. I really want to thank you for illustrating what a region like Cowichan is going through and some of the challenges, and also Vancouver Island more generally, because being an island, we do have those issues with transportation and so on.

One of the big themes we've seen run through this committee in our hearings over the summer and continuing until the present day has been the theme of resiliency and how we build resiliency in our local food systems. I really thank you for mentioning that. It is a really important term. COVID-19 has put a big shock into our system, and we have to learn the lessons from this time to build for the future.

I want to go into some of the specifics that you outlined from your presentation. When you are speaking to farmers in the region and up and down Vancouver Island, can you talk a little bit about some of the specific things they really need? You're saying that you've seen an explosion of farm gates and so on, but what are we missing specifically in terms of processing capacity here on the island that may allow a small operation to really realize its full potential?

[Judy Stafford]

Definitely abattoirs, as I brought up, present a hurdle for anyone trying to do livestock care. We used to have a very vibrant dairy industry. We had a lot of quota for chickens and cows. Those have left the island for a variety of reasons. A major one was changes in regulations that were just too prohibitive for the small-scale farmer to run their own little processing and their own abattoir, when they would need a bathroom separate from the farmhouse. I even heard they would need one bathroom for the girls and one for the boys, but that might have changed.

When the processing regulations shifted a few years ago, we lost a lot of abattoirs right off the island completely. Definitely processing is the number one hurdle, especially with poultry and beef, which is mostly what is raised here, and again there's the kitchen capacity of a small-scale farmer. Maybe they just want to grow potatoes and not a huge amount of vegetables.

There isn't storage here. There are no cold storage facilities here in Cowichan at all. That's another thing that would be part of our hub.

Also, to be honest, there isn't a lot of manpower. Labour is expensive, so one of the services we want to set up in our new kitchen is a processing service so you can drop off your vegetables. You've already worked all day. You've harvested all day. Maybe you've been at two or three farmers' markets. You can drop off your excess, and we'll process it for you and give it back to you with a fee for service. One of the things I'm hearing from farmers is, “I don't have time to process”, so we're hoping to provide that service as well.

Then there's competing on price, as I said in my presentation. It's very, very hard to grow an organic carrot and sell it at a price that has value for you and your family, when carrots in Walmart are dirt cheap.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Absolutely.

You've been talking about the commercial kitchen that you want to expand. I'm sure there's room for others. What kind of a model are we looking at? Are we looking at a stand-alone commercial kitchen business or a co-operative? Do you foresee one that basically opens its doors to farmers dropping off their produce, or do you see one that a collective of farmers all pay towards, like a time-share they can use, or are all of those models plausible in the new centre?

[Judy Stafford]

All of those models are plausible. I would suggest that if it's going to cost small-scale farmers money to join something, they're not going to really have the funds to invest in that. That's why I've written probably five grants to set up this commercial kitchen. There is money in the province as well. That's a bit daunting.

When I say the process is complicated, it is complicated. I understand there are a lot of boxes to tick. I did hear on the committee that the fund is exhausted, so I'm not sure if I should continue on in the process. Basically, we're trying to set up a separate kitchen for HACCP only, because there are a lot of requirements. We do have a small-scale producer here who wants to try to sell to Alberta, and the only way she can do that is to have a HACCP-certified facility.

We're looking at setting up two kitchens now, one specifically to meet those regulations. Honestly, at this moment, the model is that we will run the kitchen and it will be available to rent on a 24-hour schedule. Online you'll book “I want four hours on Sunday afternoon”.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I have less than one minute left.

Our committee wants to table a report with some specific recommendations. Capital costs are the big barrier. When you look at programs already in existence, like the local food infrastructure fund, what kind of specific recommendations would you really love to see written in this committee report when we table it in the House of Commons?

[Judy Stafford]

You should know not to ask me that question.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

No, no, this is your moment.

[Judy Stafford]

Give a big tick to the $220,000 application that's sitting on a desk right now.

But definitely it's an amazing fund. It was available pre-COVID for $25,000. We decided to wait for the next larger amount that's available. If funds are being exhausted, I would suggest there are eight other communities on Vancouver Island that are also very, very interested in setting up these hub models. I hate to be always just asking for money, but that's what it takes. The capital investment is huge.

Thank you.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Ms. Stafford.

Thank you, Mr. MacGregor.

We now begin the second round of questions.

Mr. Lehoux, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for being here this afternoon.

Hello, everyone.

My question is for Mr. Lewis.

I'd like to follow up on the question my colleague Mr. Steinley asked earlier. Could you finish the answer you were about to give us? I think we were talking about feed from the United States, which was cheaper. Could you expand on that with a brief answer, Mr. Lewis?

[Todd Lewis]

I guess I would just.... The thought was that we end up with heavily subsidized offshore product coming into Canada, and it really displaces Canadian product that should be available within the borders of our country. All of this is about food security, really, for the entire country, be it even what Ms. Stafford is talking about: fruits and vegetables grown locally. If we're not going to get our produce out of California, where is it going to come from? I think we have to look at small processors and large processors to really provide food security, perhaps even income security, for our own country.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Chair, am I the only one having problems with interpretation?

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Other participants were apparently having interpretation issues as well.

Has it been resolved?

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Chair, your mic is on mute.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Oh, sorry about that. You can't hear me if it's closed.

Can you hear me in French, Monsieur Lehoux? Is the translation working?

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Okay. We've adjusted the time.

You may continue, Mr. Lehoux.

[Richard Lehoux, Conservative, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Lewis, could you briefly repeat your answer for me?