Agriculture Committee on Dec. 3rd, 2024

[Lawrence Hanson]

Thanks for the question, and Marie-Claude should add anything to my answer that she might wish, but I think the threshold answer to that would be kind of similar to what we would do in any kind of new program, which is, after a suitable period of time, a program evaluation to determine the impacts.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

What would a suitable amount of time be for this? I'm just curious.

[Lawrence Hanson]

Marie-Claude, I don't want to put you on the spot. I don't know if we have a standard time before we launch a program evaluation, so I'll turn to you.

[Marie-Claude Guérard, Assistant Deputy Minister, Corporate Management Branch, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

I would say that this funding is over the next three years, and usually an evaluation is after each three years of the program. That's where we will see the evaluation and look to the outcome for the program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

We are a little over time, but I wanted to be gracious. I know. I'm very flexible and very liberal.

Mr. Barlow, you have a very quick intervention on a question around documents or tabling additional information.

I will be fair to any other colleagues if you have anything very quick. Otherwise, I have a few questions, and then we're going to get out of here.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate the indulgence.

Mr. Hanson, you mentioned that there is some leeway with that program up to $10 million. Could you table with the committee what the decision was that allowed the Aspire Food Group program to go from the $5 million to $8.5 million? What was the specific trigger that allowed that to go to $8.5 million?

Last, you're requesting $14.46 million for operating expenditures. Can you table with the committee how much of that will be spent on outside consultants and how much has been spent on outside consultants each year going back 10 years, broken down by services at AAFC?

[Lawrence Hanson]

I will say that we're happy to provide information on the incrementality on the Aspire Food Group program. I don't know if it would be characterized as a trigger or what, but we are happy to provide the information that we have.

With regard to consultants and professional expenditure, I will defer to Marie-Claude, but I'm sure we can table information on that. I will just add that, especially in recent years, as a result of responsible government spending, all departments were required to lower the expenditures on these, and we are doing just that. With regard to the historical record, however, I'm sure we can provide any information we have.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

We'll leave that for the officials to table.

Colleagues, I'm just going to ask a quick round of questions.

The first is for the CFIA.

I have a document here that was prepared by, I think, 13 or 14 different organizations. It's called “Improving Access to Veterinary Pharmaceuticals, Veterinary Health Products, Livestock Feeds and Veterinary Biologics in Canada”.

Mr. Ianiro, Mr. Drouin took you down a line of questioning about the good work the CFIA does, and I understand the important role you play.

I have been an advocate, asking how we can try to align information sharing amongst agencies—I know that some of that work is done—to allow for the expedition of some of these approvals that are so crucial for the agriculture industry.

I believe there's a meeting coming up around this. Can you speak to the work that we're doing around microbial resistance and making sure that we can try to have a breadth of approvals that really matter? Veterinary approvals from the CFIA are down by 40%. That's concerning, I think, for the agriculture sector. How do we find that balance and give you the tools necessary?

[Robert Ianiro]

I think you're making reference to a recent white paper that was submitted by a series of stakeholders. I don't have all the details in front of me, but what I would quickly share is that we're definitely working with our partners at the Public Health Agency of Canada and at Health Canada because we're all kind of involved in varying degrees with these approvals.

Also, at the CFIA, I know that we're proactively trying to have meetings with a variety of industry members, as well as with, in particular, the Animal Nutrition Association of Canada, on how we can better prioritize getting submissions into Canada because there are market factors where, in some cases, submissions just are not made into Canada for whatever reasons that are business decisions. I think there was a recent meeting. I was not present at that meeting. I know that there will be continued discussions to see whatever we can do.

The other piece I would just add is that we are always looking at ways of streamlining our approvals and seeing how we can leverage—and we already have certain authorities to leverage—foreign decisions, obviously of like-minded countries. I think it's still a work in progress.

However, I would want to share with you, Mr. Chair, our commitment to continue to find ways of streamlining that and getting more products into Canada and approved into Canada as expeditiously as possible.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

No, I think that's extremely important. I don't want to speak for every member on this committee, but as the chair, I will say that this is something I hear consistently from commodity groups. I know you have a difficult job at the CFIA of balancing public safety, but we also need these tools for food security and for the success of our men and women who are out producing food.

It's good to know. Here is what I think this committee could benefit from: Are there regulatory or legislative pieces that are needed, above and beyond resourcing, to try to help support that initiative you have committed to us publicly to do?

Can I ask about bees? This committee has put up a recommendation for the CFIA to revisit its bee policy, particularly around the importation of bees. There is a bit of a split, I would say, in the industry between local honeybee production and their associations. However, certainly from the pollinators' perspective, we do allow for the importation of queen bees from California. Has the CFIA updated any of its guidance or process around the importation of bees, particularly from the state of California, in package form?

[Robert Ianiro]

With regard to the honeybees, you are correct that there are currently restrictions in place. We are in the process of completing a risk assessment. In fact, it's out for consultation. This is specific to honeybees, both queens and packages. We do allow importation from a variety of countries right now.

Specifically on pollinators, it is also something we are assessing to determine whether or not we can add the importation of pollinators from other countries. I know there were some issues last pollination season, in particular on the east coast, and we did work with some of the importers to try to find a way to make sure we assess where these pollinators are coming from. In fact, I think in some cases they were coming from Mexico, and we're definitely seized with this to ensure there are no negative impacts for the upcoming season.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

When could we expect that assessment and decision to be made by CFIA? Do you have a timeline?

[Robert Ianiro]

For the assessment on the honeybees, I understand that consultation is currently public, and it is a 60-day consultation period. We're consulting on the risk assessment that's been put out and on the proposals that would be put forward to determine how those risks can be mitigated and managed in order to look at adding more countries in the way of honeybees.

On the pollinators, I don't have a timeline. I'd have to get back to the committee on that one.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

It would be helpful for this committee if you could table that.

This is for the folks at Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada.

Again, thank you for the work that you do.

Deputy Minister Hanson, I was surprised you didn't get more questions on the Canada-U.S. relationship given some of the threats of tariffs and, obviously, the work that needs to be done by the government. Is there work being done within the department on cross-border mutual benefits? I think there are things we can do, such as aligning on certain harmonization of policies where it makes sense for farmers in Canada and the United States.

Is there some scoping work being done by your ministry on things of mutual benefit between industries in Canada and the U.S. just as we start to take an even deeper look at this relationship in the days ahead?

[Lawrence Hanson]

Yes, there are the built-in elements of the shared interests of the two countries. As members of this committee will know well, we are key export and import destinations for one another, up to and including the fact that livestock will often travel across the border, so there's a great deal of supply chain mutual dependency here.

On the issue of regulatory collaboration, this is always an ongoing issue with us, but there is also a formal kind of regulatory realignment process with ongoing work led by the Treasury Board, which is working with the United States on those issues as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

I don't want to presuppose where we may go in January, but this could be an interesting area of study in terms of cross-border collaboration, particularly on the harmonization piece around the regulatory aspect. Certainly for our folks at CFIA, I know there's a lot of good work, and we'd love to be able to encourage that work to even continue deeper.

Thank you, colleagues, for your indulgence on a round of questions.

I will, on your behalf, thank our public servants for their work on behalf of Canadian agriculture. Thank you for appearing today.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Mr. Chair, on the fertilizer letter on Sollio, did we come to a decision on that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

I was not here on Thursday, as you know, but I will ask the clerk. She is away. We are meeting on Thursday, so I will make sure in the interim period that—

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Can we just leave a little time there, then?

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Yes, I will make sure we set aside time.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Great. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

That's a good reminder, colleagues, that we will see you Thursday on the rail study.

Before we go, we had better approve the estimates. That's why we're ultimately here.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[An hon. member]

We almost got away with it.