Evidence of meeting #2 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was wart.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Bobby Morrissey Liberal Egmont, PE
Okay. That's understandable. I understand that you can't comment.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Kody Blois
Thank you, Mr. Morrissey. I did give you a bit of extra time just so we could allow Ms. Mithani.
Thank you very much to all my colleagues and to the witnesses for their testimony.
That ends panel one.
On behalf of the entire committee, I would like to thank the witnesses for taking the time tonight to be here with us. I'll let you excuse yourselves.
Folks, we are going to be just two or three minutes at the most for a pause before we get into our next panel. We're going to let the clerk take some sound checks. We're going to suspend momentarily, but please don't go far. Thanks.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Kody Blois
Members, we're going to get started again.
Thank you to our witnesses.
We have our second panel here today. On behalf of the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada, we have with us Tom Rosser, the assistant deputy minister, and on behalf of the P.E.I. Potato Board, we have the general manager, Greg Donald.
Welcome, both of you.
We have five minutes for opening remarks. We're running a bit behind, but we're going to get started right away.
Mr. Rosser, it's over to you for five minutes.
Tom Rosser Assistant Deputy Minister, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Thank you, Mr. Chair, for inviting me to appear before the committee this afternoon. Congratulations on being elected chair of the committee.
I want to thank the committee for holding this special meeting on the potato wart situation in Prince Edward Island and its impact on farm families, workers and agribusinesses.
As you heard earlier, the CFIA investigation continues, as quickly as possible, to give the U.S. the data they want so we can resume exports of fresh potatoes from P.E.I. Until that happens, the situation remains difficult and stressful for producers, for their families and for those who work in the supply chain, from grading to packing to trucking and so on.
The potato industry is a significant economic driver on the island. The department has been working hard to determine how best to support producers in the industry and help relieve some of the significant financial pressures they are facing. Some support has already been made available to producers under our business risk management programs. The P.E.I. and federal governments recently collaborated to amend the AgriStability program so that potato producers can enrol up to December 31, 2022, and receive interim payments of up to 75%. Farm Credit Canada has reached out to help producers, with flexible payments and other options to relieve cash flow pressures. These measures help, but they are not enough.
Yesterday Minister Bibeau announced a federal investment of $28 million to help P.E.I. potato farmers with the management of surplus potatoes. This funding will be used to support the diversion of surplus potatoes by redirecting the surplus to food banks and other food security organizations. It will help in facilitating increased sales to processors and supporting environmentally sound disposal of surplus potatoes. Funding will also support marketing activities to develop long-term strategies to manage future challenges. AAFC officials will work with the P.E.I. Potato Board, national food bank organizations, the province and other stakeholder groups to deliver this funding.
We will have more details to share very shortly in the coming days and weeks. We aim to get this urgent support to producers as soon as we possibly can. The funding is a first tranche of federal supports, while work continues to assess impacts and find solutions for affected P.E.I. farmers, in collaboration with the provincial government.
Meanwhile, we're pulling out all the stops to meet the U.S. technical requirements and get our message to our U.S. partners. It's science-based messaging that we are delivering—namely, that the trade in fresh potatoes from P.E.I. remains safe when appropriate risk mitigation measures are in place.
Collaboration is key. We plan to take a team Canada approach. We're working with a potato working group made up of government and industry to keep us all on the same page and focused on our common goal. Yesterday the minister also announced the appointment of Fred Gorrell as the new co-chair of the potato working group. Mr. Gorrell is very well known within the sector and comes with years of experience as a former assistant deputy minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada and leader of our market access secretariat.
We are continuing our concerted effort to engage with our U.S. partners at all levels. Earlier this month, Deputy Minister Chris Forbes met with his counterpart in Washington, Deputy Secretary Bronaugh. They discussed collaboration on restoring market access for P.E.I. potatoes. The minister is in regular contact with Secretary Vilsack, and she met late last week with Ambassador Cohen. The Prime Minister has raised this issue with President Biden, and Minister Ng with her counterpart in Washington and many members of Congress. There are many other high-level engagements with senior U.S. officials.
We're doing what we can to keep up the pressure, but none of this can happen fast enough for producers. Resolving the trade issue with the U.S. is the minister's top priority and will remain so. Everyone is fully engaged and focused on resolving this difficult situation as quickly as we possibly can.
Thank you for your attention, Mr. Chair. That concludes my remarks.
Liberal
Greg Donald General Manager, Prince Edward Island Potato Board
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair and members of this committee, for inviting me to speak today regarding the current crisis that the Prince Edward Island potato industry is facing.
I know that other speakers have talked about the fungus. It's a disease that we've been dealing with very well for the last almost 21 years here in P.E.I. As has been mentioned, the long-term domestic potato wart management plan has served us well to prevent the spread of potato wart as well as manage any future detections in order to avoid a repeat of the pain of 2000.
The plan has worked. This year, as discussed, wart was found in two processing fields that were already under restrictions by CFIA because of previous finds. When we heard of them this year, we were concerned, but our immediate reaction was that the plan worked exactly the way that it was supposed to.
Having said that, this time the tone of the communications from CFIA was changed. As we listened to the change in tone on the part of CFIA, our organization responded by reminding CFIA of the very solid third party visual data that would provide additional evidence that the rest of P.E.I. was not infected with potato wart. CFIA did not acknowledge that data and chose to focus only on soil sampling. We learned from other countries that have potato wart but still export all over the world, the Netherlands being one such example, that visual data plays a huge role in the management of this disease.
We understand that USDA threatened to close the border to all Canadian seed potatoes. To prevent that loss of trade, particularly for western Canada, CFIA suspended the shipment of P.E.I. seed potatoes to the U.S. CFIA also promised the U.S. it would also find a way to suspend the shipment of P.E.I. seed potatoes to the rest of Canada. CFIA's easiest way of doing this was a ministerial order. To justify this, it used the words that the entire province of P.E.I. is “infested with potato wart”. The U.S. then turned around and used this against us, and we are where we are, with a complete ban on the shipment of all P.E.I. potatoes to the United States.
CFIA says the risk from shipping washed sprout-inhibited potatoes from non-restricted P.E.I. fields is extremely low. Indeed, we are shipping potatoes across Canada to offshore markets based on internationally accepted risk mitigation measures. The U.S. is apparently not accepting those measures, even though it is a basis for how they ship potatoes around the world, including Japan and into Canada. There are regulated or quarantined potato pests in 16 different U.S. states, and potatoes from those states enter Canada based on those mitigation measures. We talk about equivalency in phytosanitary measures, but that is not the case in P.E.I. this year.
We asked for a $60-million diversion program to destroy potatoes that will not be able to move to market because of the U.S. ban and the ministerial order. Yesterday Minister Bibeau announced $28 million for that, and local media said it was the first phase of financial assistance for our farmers. Today we learned that the funding will not cover any of the costs or value of the potatoes. It is intended to cover only the cost of hauling the potatoes out of storage and running them through snow blowers. We were shocked. We asked for 12¢ per pound to establish a floor price for the Canadian market, but now AAFC has effectively established a floor price of 4¢ per pound.
We spoke with AAFC and the minister's office about this today and we're hopeful that they will revisit this crippling decision. It is yet another blow to our farmers. They deserve none of this. It will also mean much lower prices for potatoes grown in every province for the rest of the winter.
I have a few key questions before I wrap up. Does the CFIA have confidence in our wart management plan or not? If it does, it should communicate that more forcefully to the United States. The export of washed and sprout-inhibited fresh potatoes has worked smoothly for the last 20 years as a result of this plan. What has changed? Potato wart has not spread to other provinces or countries from Prince Edward Island. A just-completed national survey by the CFIA resulted in no potato wart detections in any other province in Canada. That's great news, and it's further confirmation of the strength of the wart management plan.
I'm just going to add that the potato industry on P.E.I. is willing to work with the CFIA to provide additional safeguards or assurances to the U.S. to reopen the border. We know that the same goes for our provincial government, which has had our backs since the start. We have made suggestions, as has the provincial government, but we don't know if those offers have been shared with the U.S.
In my career working in the potato industry, this is the largest crisis we have yet faced. The stress on our farmers and packers is immense. Not only are farmers trying to figure out what to do with potatoes they can't sell this winter; they're also trying to figure out whether to plant potatoes next year. Unless there's immediate progress made, I'm afraid that a number of our family farms will exit the industry and that irreparable damage will be done to our industry and the Prince Edward Island economy.
We appreciate the committee looking into this situation.
In our minds, it is not just another trade irritant with our biggest trading partner; it is one that could be resolved if the will is there. The U.S. is short of potatoes, and bars in the U.S. want our potatoes—
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Kody Blois
Mr. Donald, I don't mean to interrupt, but you are at time, and we want to stay on time. I know that you'll have the opportunity to answer questions.
We're going to start with our panel for six minutes each.
Mr. Barlow, it looks like you might be moving ahead.
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mr. Donald, for being here.
Mr. Rosser, it's good to see you again. I'll start with you.
Certainly nobody wants this to be a long-drawn-out process. We were supposed to have dispute resolute provisions within CUSMA, so I'm curious: Does the minister's suspension of certification prevent Canada from utilizing the dispute settlement mechanism that is in CUSMA?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
I would say that the committee that we have established—the working group—is looking at all options. We have trade experts there. We are certainly looking at this from a trade angle as well as a plant health one.
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
Okay. It is a bit disconcerting that this isn't an ironclad “yes” or “no” at this point and that this wasn't discussed. No disrespect to you, Mr. Rosser, but I was hoping that this would have been an ironclad “yes” or “no” before this decision to suspend the certification was decided upon.
In 2000, when we had potato wart first detected, we did use the dispute resolution under NAFTA. If we've used this before and we fought to keep this dispute resolution in CUSMA, why are we not using it?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food
Well, we certainly haven't given up the ability to use it. It is an option among others, but one thing that's certain about the CUSMA and WTO processes is that they are not quick. They extend over a period of a year or more. It remains an option. We are in active discussion with the industry and the province about what the available options are.
What's known about that one, as I said, is that it will not bring resolution nearly as quickly as we would like to in this situation.
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
Mr. Rosser, we're already hearing from CFIA that this could be prolonged well into 2023. We're not just talking about this year's harvest. We could be talking about next year's harvest, potentially, and I would hope that all tools are being used to ensure this is resolved as quickly as possible.
Mr. Donald, I'll turn to you. I think it's fair to say that in your presentation you see this as maybe more of a political mistake in terms of CFIA communication—and that maybe we were played a bit here—more than this being a decision based on sound science.
General Manager, Prince Edward Island Potato Board
Yes, I would agree with that comment. I believe it started out with the detection, but the way it was communicated kind of created the opportunity for it to become more than a scientific conversation.
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
Before this export certification ban was placed—and you heard the semantics around this being a ban—was there any consultation from the government with you and the potato board in terms of what actions were going to be taken and what the ramifications of those actions would be?
General Manager, Prince Edward Island Potato Board
Just so I'm clear, are you referencing since this year's detections?
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
When the export ban was put on earlier this year, before the minister made that announcement, was the potato board in P.E.I. consulted in terms of the actions the current government was going to take?
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
We've now heard publicly that the CFIA is saying that this could be prolonged into 2023, as I've said. What kind of impact could this have on the P.E.I. potato industry, but more specifically on the farmers themselves and on the farm families who are being impacted by this?
General Manager, Prince Edward Island Potato Board
On the last question you asked, Mr. Barlow, I just want to answer that we were were informed, as I said, of some of the wishes or interests or threats, I'll say, from the U.S., based on what they want. It wasn't discussed with us what those actions were that were put in place.
I'm sorry, but I'm still thinking about that. What was your question?
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
Okay. I have a limited amount of time, so if I have time for that, I'll go back.
Conservative
John Barlow Conservative Foothills, AB
No, no, that's okay.
Can I just get clarification? On that $28 million that Minister Bibeau announced, not a single dime of that is going to the farmers themselves. This is merely a fund to destroy product. Did I hear you correctly?