Agriculture Committee on June 9th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Mr. MacDougall.

[Peter MacDougall]

Our starting point in most years before, as I said, either the government provides additional money or we access something called the crisis pool is about $609 million or $610 million. To date we've moved about $514 million of that, with $245 million going to the Ukraine response. While the vast majority of that is in Ukraine, including $93 million in direct food assistance, it also goes to support neighbouring countries, particularly Moldova, which is not an EU member state.

We do work extensively with local organizations. This was raised earlier, and I want to make the point that we provide support to something called a “country-based pooled fund”, which works directly with over 110 Ukrainian and civil society organizations to deliver humanitarian assistance.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

Thank you.

I know there was an initial government matching program to leverage funds from the public, donations to the Red Cross. Are there any plans to expand that to again leverage the public's interest here?

[Peter MacDougall]

Thank you.

That was an enormously successful matching fund, I think by far the most successful matching fund we've ever done. We put up $30 million, and the Red Cross response more than matched that. I think it ended up at $150 million.

At this point there are no plans to launch an additional fund.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

Thank you.

Obviously the crisis has brought two drivers here. There's the availability of food in parts of the world that Ukraine and Russia supplied, and there's the price effect. I don't want to compare them, but can you talk about the intensity? My own fears are—and I've heard this in other places—that once a population's caloric daily intake drops below 1,800 calories per person on average, you have instability, which leads to civil instability and all the other things you've touched on. Is that a greater threat here even than is the lack of food getting to certain populations?

[Peter MacDougall]

Thank you. That's an excellent question.

There's a classification system that goes from one to five, with five being famine-like conditions. For classifications four and five, that being extreme hunger bordering on famine, we've seen that go from 44 million to 49 million just within the last many months, in large part because of the exacerbation of the food-security crisis. It's a real risk; there's no question about it. Whether it will result in things like mass migration, I think, is hard to say, but I think it will most likely result in people rising up and protesting against their governments and potential internal civil conflicts, which we're seeing some of now.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

More specifically, to go back to Ukraine, the minister referenced the issue of Russia's appropriating grain and then selling it. Will there potentially be a government response from Canada? Could we use sanctions in situations in which that could be proven? I know we've heard about Syria, and we have little effect there, but there have been allegations with respect to Turkey, which is also a NATO member. Are we looking at any options or, even as a deterrent, at putting out a policy and things like that to begin to address that phenomenon?

[Peter MacDougall]

I have not heard any mention of Turkey. Tara can perhaps fill out more here than I can, but I do know that we have sanctions, for example, against Russian ships. Those certainly act as at least a partial deterrent but not a total one.

[Dave Epp, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON]

Thank you. I think that's my time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Go ahead just quickly, Ms. Denham. You have 15 or 20 seconds.

[Tara Denham]

Just in addition to that, we also are doing a broad-based diplomatic engagement through which we do outreach to countries. As Peter said, we don't always have the same influence in certain countries, but we are engaging with multiple countries to make sure they're aware of the issue, they understand the realities and they align or try to advocate for not purchasing the grains.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you very much to both of you.

Ms. Valdez, it's over to you for five minutes.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, witnesses, for being here today to share your testimony on this important matter. As someone who was born in Africa, I do want to thank you for all of the work you are doing to help those back home, as well as helping the Ukrainians.

My question is for Mr. MacDougall. We heard from the Ukrainian minister today that farmers are facing several challenges, including being forced to live under Russian law and to convert to Russian-registered businesses. Can you share what kind of actions if any are being taken to help combat these challenges?

[Peter MacDougall]

I think the global community has brought the full suite to bear in responding to Russian aggression—military assistance, financial support, sanctions—really the full array of responses. Those particular examples would be very challenging, as repugnant as they are, to respond to.

That would be my general response, and I'll see if Tara has anything more specific.

[Tara Denham]

I would just add that you will have also seen that we have returned to Kyiv to engage in high-level diplomatic interactions with Ukraine, and so on that side, we do have our head of mission in Kyiv engaging with the Government of Ukraine. As Peter said, there are specific scenarios and in occupied territories it's very difficult, but we're doing everything we can to engage with the Ukrainians to understand the situation and to understand where there can be assistance and coordination and alignment with Canada.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you. As a business owner myself, I can say that assistance is going to greatly help them on the ground.

You mentioned the significant increase in food insecurity. What has been the global response to that increase as a result of the invasion of Ukraine?

[Peter MacDougall]

I think you've seen a lot of countries step up. I've described the Canadian response. Certainly the United States has significantly increased its investments, by $11 billion over five years, in food system support, food security and nutrition support around the world. The U.K. has made new investments of $10 million, and Netherlands and Italy have as well.

Germany, in addition to contributing almost €1 billion to support local food supply, has also, through the G7 meeting that it's hosting, really galvanized action to create a global alliance for food security, which our ministers are engaged with.

The French are leading something called a farm and agriculture resilience mission, which is trying to provide coherence and coordination on policy on and investment in food support.

There is also the full range of UN actors, including the World Food Programme and the FAO, which we have mentioned, as well as the International Fund for Agricultural Development and many other UN institutions, and then the bank system, the system of international financial institutions.

You will know that Canada has been active, particularly in the Ukrainian context, in providing additional support to Ukraine but also with our investments in the World Bank and in regional development banks. We've seen those banks step up, particularly the African Development Bank, to respond to the food crisis by both lending and granting money to countries in very dire situations.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thank you. I appreciate your adding that colour.

What do the sanctions imposed on Russia mean for our exports, whether those be oil, rubber, wheat or any other agricultural products?

[Peter MacDougall]

I'm sorry—what do those mean? Can you clarify? Do you mean for Canadian exports?

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

That's correct. How do they affect us?

[Peter MacDougall]

I'm just not understanding. Can you try once more with that question? My apologies.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Here in Canada, we export multiple things, so with the sanctions we have imposed on Russia, has there been any impact here?

[Peter MacDougall]

I'll take a quick crack at that, but I also think it's a question that could be addressed to Agriculture officials.

With respect to the sanctions on Belarusian potash, Canada, of course, is a major producer and, from what I understand, Canada has increased production of potash and will be opening a new potash mine in response, so where possible you will see Canadian industry doing everything it can to respond to gaps in the marketplace.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

We'll have to leave it at that. Thank you, Mr. MacDougall.

Thank you, Ms. Valdez.

We will now go to Mr. Perron for two and a half minutes.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We talk a lot about global food insecurity. Of course, the situation in Ukraine is of great concern, but the food crisis that is coming in August is also a huge cause for concern. I'm very worried about that.

Do we have a multilateral stance, strategy or plan of action in this regard to address food needs or to assist African countries that may be experiencing famine?

Could you speak to that, please?