Bill C-39 Committee on Oct. 9th, 2026

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Good morning, everybody. Happy Friday morning. I want to call this meeting to order.

First, I want to say thank you to all of you for being here on a Friday. I've had the honour—I think, although that remains to be seen, depending on how things go—to be asked to be the chair of this committee, and I truly am honoured to do that. I look forward to working with each and every one of you to discuss this very important bill.

I'll start by apologizing for the Friday morning meeting on the day before the Thanksgiving weekend. However, the alternative was next week, which is a break week, and I figured this was the least hazardous for my health. I appreciate everybody's being here today.

Welcome to meeting number one of the House of Commons Legislative Committee on Bill C-39. The committee is meeting today pursuant to the order of reference of Thursday, October 8, 2026. Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Members are attending in person in the room and remotely using the Zoom application.

Before we continue, I would ask all in-person participants to consult the guidelines written on the cards on the table. These measures are in place to help prevent audio and feedback incidents and to protect the health and safety of all participants, including the interpreters. You will also notice a QR code on the card; it links to a short awareness video.

I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of the members. I will remind you that all comments should be addressed through the chair. If you wish to speak, please raise your hand. The clerk and I will manage the speaking order as best we can, and we appreciate your patience and understanding.

As per the notice of meeting, the purpose of today's meeting is to discuss committee business. Members of the committee have received a copy of the draft routine motions. The committee can now proceed to those motions.

I should start by saying thank you to our clerk too. We look forward to working with you as well. We know this is going to be a big task, so we're very grateful.

Let's move into routine motions.

Oh, I'm sorry, Mr. Albas. You have your hand up.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair.

Congratulations. I offer my condolences on your receiving the honour of serving as the chair of this wonderful group.

I would simply say that we Conservatives have reviewed the routine motions. We find everything that was circulated to be in order, and we would just table that.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Okay. I appreciate that.

Go ahead, Mr. Ste-Marie.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

The same goes for the Bloc Québécois. We are fine with the routine motions.

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and congratulations.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

I'm going to take a moment to hear from my colleagues to our right.

Just so you're aware of what's going on, I'll say that Mr. Albas has proposed that we adopt all the motions at once. I'm suspending for a moment so that everybody has an opportunity to review them and we can decide whether that's the path we choose.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

All right, we're back in session.

Do we have unanimous consent?

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Mr. Chair, I have a point of order.

We don't have a copy of the motions. I understand they haven't been passed yet and, of course, all members of Parliament have the right to come to committee.

Is it possible for us to get a copy of the motions?

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Yes, I think once the motions are passed.... I mean, they're the usual procedural motions that we've all looked at and adopted many times, but I'm happy to do that.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

I don't know what the motions are. Are these motions that talk about the procedures that are going to be adopted?

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Yes, they're about how much time witnesses have for opening remarks, document distribution, travel, in camera meetings, etc. It's the usual of things that we go through, but I'm happy to get them to you, Mr. Davies.

Okay, do we have unanimous consent to adopt the procedural motions?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

(Motions agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

We'll go on to committee business, then.

Mr. Albas, go ahead. You have your hand up.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm delighted to be joining you all today. I'm glad to see we had some unanimity around the concept of the routine motions. The Conservatives want to see things built. We've been arguing for the past 11 years that this country has not gotten it right, largely under the direction of the previous government, and now under the current government.

We would like to see some changes made. We know the Liberals seem to be very intent on a very speedy timeline, but we want to make sure that we scrutinize the bill. What I'm suggesting, Mr. Chair, is the following motion to give this committee some guardrails in order to see that we scrutinize the legislation and that we have the opportunity to bring in witnesses and bring forward amendments in a timely way. We hope that the government will be in agreement with this.

I move the following motion:

That, for the purpose of its consideration of Bill C-39, the committee:

a. Invite the following ministers, accompanied by officials, to appear before the committee, separately, for one hour each:

1. The Honourable Steven MacKinnon, Minister of Transport and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons,

2. The Honourable Julie Dabrusin, Minister of the Environment, Climate Change and Nature, and

3. The Honourable Patty Hajdu, Minister of Jobs and Families and Minister responsible for the Federal Economic Development Agency for Northern Ontario;

b. Invite parties represented on the committee to provide preliminary witness lists to the Clerk, ranked in priority order, provided that they are received by the Clerk by no later than 12:00PM on Friday, October 9, 2026;

c. Invite parties represented on the committee to provide final witness lists to the Clerk, ranked in priority order, provided that they are received by the Clerk by no later than 5:00PM on Thursday, October 15, 2026;

d. Instruct the Chair to, wherever possible, schedule three witnesses per panel, except for the witnesses referenced in (a);

e. Set a deadline of 5:00PM on Thursday, October 29, 2026, for amendments to be submitted to the Clerk;

f. Begin clause-by-clause consideration of the bill during the week of November 2, 2026;

g. Notwithstanding the above deadlines and requirements, allow for flexibility respecting the committee’s agenda should the occasion arise to justify it; and

h. Issue a press release requesting interested stakeholders to submit briefs to the committee, provided that it advises stakeholders that it is preferred that briefs are submitted in both official languages and that they must be received by the Clerk by no later than 5:00PM on Thursday, October 22, 2026, to be considered by the committee.

Thank you.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

If I may, Mr. St-Pierre, I'm going to say this, and we can discuss this around the table.

By way of preliminary remarks, this committee has just been struck. Not everybody even had the motion in their hand beforehand. I appreciate the effort to do this. As you know, I was appointed chair under 24 hours ago, but I can tell you this: My goal is to get some of these deadlines confirmed when we leave today.

My only ask of the committee is really that.... We all share your view. We want to get this thing done efficiently. We all really share your view strongly. I know we'll make sure that we do it thoroughly and that everybody who wants and needs to be heard gets to be heard. If we can all work together and be collegial, which I know we can, we can accomplish this.

Having said that, because we have just started and because it was so quick, my concern is that if we set hard deadlines on all of these things today, we're going to box ourselves in and we're going to regret it. I can tell you now that the three lead ministers on this on this piece of legislation have confirmed their availability to attend on October 19 to start off our first meeting, which will be on the Monday following the Thanksgiving break week. I think that's important to get us started.

In terms of witness panels and deadlines, what I'm proposing—and I'm just throwing this out there in the context of the motion—is that we agree on a preliminary list of witnesses by the end of today, or sometime today—perhaps even immediately after this meeting is over—with another option to submit further witness lists by next week. This gives everybody a bit more time to absorb what we're doing and give it some thought.

In terms of the panels and whatnot, it's always a good idea...but in my experience, good intentions fall by the wayside very quickly, because you send out invitations to witnesses and some are not available and some cannot or do not want to attend, and you end up being unable to stick to that rigid process.

Those are some preliminary thoughts of mine. I appreciate the spirit. I don't want to get wedded to too much today, because when we come back—once we have a better idea—we can sort it out.

I'll give you the floor, Mr. Albas, and then I'll go to Mr. St-Pierre.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Okay.

Go ahead, Mr. St-Pierre.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

My last name is Ste‑Marie, not St‑Pierre.

When there's a motion, it's customary to get a paper copy in both official languages, so I'd like to have a hard copy of the motion that was just proposed in both official languages, please. When the motion is read, it's also customary to provide the interpreters with a copy.

That's the reason for my point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

That's a very fair point of order. I didn't have a copy in front of me until after Mr. Albas started speaking, and it's in only one language. I agree with you, so why don't we suspend for a moment to see if we can remedy that, and then we'll come back?

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

I call this meeting back to order.

Did everybody get a copy of the motion? They did. Okay, so we're all good.

Everybody has the up-to-date motion in both languages. I believe there were two versions circulating around. There have been spelling errors corrected, too, I understand.

I had a speaking list with Mr. St-Pierre, and then I had Mr. Lake—

[Some hon. members]

Ste-Marie.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

What did I say?

[Some hon. members]

St-Pierre.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

I'm sorry. It's the lack of coffee and an early morning.

I'm sorry, Mr. Ste-Marie.

I then have Mr. Albas, Mr. Lake and Ms. Desrochers.

[Gabriel Ste-Marie, Bloc, Joliette—Manawan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank the member for his motion. We have it in both official languages. Obviously, it's customary to share the motion ahead of time with the members of each party when possible and to make sure the interpreters have a copy.

This is a very complex bill we're going to study. It's 250 pages plus, it affects a number of departments, and it makes changes that are going to have a profound impact on society. It is in everyone's interest and in the interest of democracy that we make sure every group, every organization affected by the bill has enough time to review it, analyze it and reach out to the committee. That's why I find the motion very helpful.

However, as far as the last few paragraphs of the motion are concerned, I think the deadlines in paragraphs (e), (f) and (h) are too soon. We're already into October, and this is just our first meeting.

I propose amending the deadlines for submitting amendments, submitting briefs and beginning clause-by-clause consideration. I propose postponing each of those three deadlines by a week. Therefore, I propose that the motion be amended by replacing the words “Thursday, October 29” with the words “Thursday, November 5”, replacing the words “November 2” with the words “November 9”, and replacing the words “Thursday, October 22” with the words “Thursday, October 29”.

I was on the finance committee for a good few years. Whenever we had a very lengthy and complex budget implementation bill and we rushed through it too quickly, as happened during the pandemic, civic society found out about the problems when it was too late. Issues arose because the study had already been done.

I really want to make sure that those affected by the bill have another week to go through what's in it and reach out to the committee, if necessary, so they can make the bill better. That is why I propose postponing each of those three deadlines by a week.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.