Bill C-39 Committee on Oct. 26th, 2026

[Regional Chief Abram Benedict]

Absolutely. Thank you for that.

To build upon my earlier comments around the assessments and the importance of collaboration, respect, understanding and upholding the treaty and the Crown obligations around that, the one thing that is quite concerning and you have to understand is that all of our nations have been impacted by colonial legislation for a very long time. In fact, the colonial piece of legislation, the Indian Act, determines how first nations can and can't do certain things. We have seen many of the negative impacts of legislation, including the Indian Act. To have legislation that gives the government the ability to do what it wants, when it wants, is very concerning to our people because this is what has been done to our people for a very long time.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

If the Impact Assessment Agency, in total good faith, went community by community on this project and gave you meaningful consultation and engagement, answered all of your questions and got, let's say, theoretically, a sign-off, it would then go to one minister who could change it, at their discretion. A cabinet could then place those materially changed parameters into law. Is that a possibility?

Do you see, possibly, where it could be either abused or, even if it were to happen that the government was working in good faith, that we could end up seeing this go to the Federal Court?

[Regional Chief Abram Benedict]

It's very unfortunate, but what you have described continues to be in existence today. There actually still continue to be the powers vested to the Minister of Crown–Indigenous Relations, whoever it is, to approve or disallow certain actions on first nation territories. These are the lives and the impacts on first nations. Additional legislation that gives the government the ability to do whatever it wants after it has done perhaps a fulsome process—or so they would believe—but still comes down to a single department or person, is very concerning to us.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

Again, this would not be the Minister of Crown–Indigenous Relations. This would be the minister responsible for the Building Canada Act. I appreciate that.

We've been asking this of other groups. Would you support amendments to Bill C-39 that would limit the discretion to fundamentally change a program so that, if new information became available or there were non-compliance issues, the minister could respond to those things, but there would need to be objective criteria and public disclosure?

[Regional Chief Abram Benedict]

I would go back to my earlier submissions talking about the process for studying this bill. It needs to be more fulsome so that our nations can absolutely have the ability to say what they're comfortable with and what they're not.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

I want to thank the three of you for being here.

Chief Schilling and Mr. Phillips, if you could say whether you're in concurrence or not, I would like to have you on the record regarding an amendment that would limit the authority that the minister would have.

[Chief Harlan Schilling]

I would absolutely agree with that. Again, it's about coming together. It really is. Again, the fact that one person could veto.... Again, we're going in and saying this is what we've agreed on and then to have a minister able to change that...it's 2026. We have rights. It's known.

Yes, I would have a problem with that.

[Robert Phillips]

I concur.

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Okanagan Lake West—South Kelowna, BC]

I appreciate that. I wish I were more succinct.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you, Mr. Albas.

We now go over to Dr. Martin.

[Danielle Martin, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Thank you.

Thank you, all three of you, for being here this evening. You honour us with your presence. I've been really listening to what you've been saying. I think we've all heard about the importance of true partnership and relationships from each of you. We've heard about the importance of true economic benefits, not just for Canada as a whole but for first nations, and about the importance of protecting nature. I'd like to dive into each of those three themes in my limited time, if I may.

I want to start with you, Chief Schilling.

You painted a beautiful picture that we could imagine about the north. I think we all know, although you do understand it more deeply than most of us, that in order to have any reasonable economic development that protects nature in the north, there's other infrastructure that needs to be built to allow that. You spoke about electrical grids. There is obviously road and telecommunications infrastructure and so on.

Can you speak from your perspective about what kinds of infrastructure you've heard from your communities would be important and would have additional benefits to the communities beyond just the benefits of enabling a particular project?

[Chief Harlan Schilling]

I've had the benefit of travelling a good portion of the world on behalf of Canada on trade missions. One thing I can say is that the world's only getting smaller. These areas, again, are disappearing.

Right now, we're cutting 322 kilometres of trail within the DKK with campsites every 10 kilometres and cabins every 20 kilometres. Adventure tourism is a thing with the amount of economic development we bring in just with hunting and fishing within that area.

I sometimes disagree with the words “indigenous protected area” because the DKK is an area that we are trying to protect, but we're trying to open it to the entire world. Northern British Columbia is one of the last untouched boreal forests that we have of 3.1 million hectares. It's what the world deserves to see. It really is. Every time these areas get unprotected status, they're gone. You see it in South America. You see it all over the world. Canada can and should be the leading factor in that type of space. We have the space for it. We have the government for it, and we have the first nation indigenous people who just want to be a part of it and can lead it.

[Danielle Martin, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

That's exciting to imagine.

You made reference to the previous panel, in which our panellists talked about the importance of protecting nature and trying to find a route to projects that would be not just okay or not harmful but actually potentially positive for nature.

From your perspective, can you speak about what that means to the communities you represent?

[Chief Harlan Schilling]

Again, I'm very honoured that our DKK project is a part of the Y2Y—Yellowstone to Yukon—initiative. It was just selected as a finalist for the Earthshot Prize next month in Mumbai, which the Prime Minister and I were invited to for projects of global significance. If this is won, it will be the first time a Canadian project has ever won the Earthshot Prize. I couldn't be more proud to have it be something that we have worked on in western Canada.

These are things that we need to show the world. With the diverse things happening within our economy, they cannot change who we are as Canadians or who we are as northerners. Yes, we need economic development, but we also need to do it with balance. We have the landscape. We have the people. We can do it.

[Danielle Martin, Liberal, University—Rosedale, ON]

Thank you.

This comes back to something that I heard Mr. Phillips say, I think, that conservation and development must happen together. I'm wondering if you can speak a bit about your strong words related to equity ownership and how you see first nations being able to come to the table, for example, through the planning process. These regional development areas are intended as a planning tool so that this kind of consultation can occur.

How do you see first nations engaging on those questions?

[Robert Phillips]

When you build something, you also have to fix something. There's an impact on the land, the water and the resources. It's a restoration vision. In British Columbia, it's an indigenous-led, first nations-led restoration. I believe that's an economy on its own.

We have Kevin Scott, the president of Resolve Canada, who I work with. He's going all around the world talking to pension funds and billionaires so that they will invest. We're projecting in British Columbia-led.... The best way I can explain it is that it's a B.C. pilot project for restoration. These are not just small projects that we do all over the place. It's the whole province. It would be $150 billion over 10 years. That would mean jobs, employment, skills and training. It's all of the fires and impacts you talked about, the impact on tourism when fires happen, financing, policy, procedure, risk, opportunities and remedies on the land.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you, Dr. Martin.

Mr. Lemire, you're the last one up tonight.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to my colleagues for welcoming me.

Kwe, Chief Abram Benedict. It's good to see you again. We participated in a number of demonstrations together on the Chalk River issue. The Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission was widely criticized for its lack of consultation with first nations in this case. This finding was confirmed by the Federal Court, but the Federal Court of Appeal has just overturned this ruling.

Among the factors the Federal Court of Appeal can take into account are current political events. However, the only thing that has changed politically, in my opinion, is the introduction of Bill C‑39.

Do you think the introduction of this bill, particularly the part on first nations consultations and the power of the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission, may have had an impact on the judges and created precedents that will completely exclude first nations from using their fundamental right to claim protection of their lands?

[Regional Chief Abram Benedict]

Thank you for the question. It's quite loaded, I would say.

There still should be some judicial independence in this country that we can stand behind, because we have seen very clearly what happens when it is not very close to us, including in my community, which is a border community. I believe that is why it's fundamentally important that the legislation is clear, that the principles that I've described are enshrined in legislation and that the principles that continue to exist—not only a treaty relationship between our nations and the Crown, but also in the international conventions—continue to be embraced.

On building meaningful relationships based on the principles and respecting the inherent jurisdiction that our nations have, perhaps we wouldn't have decisions being made like that, because the tone starts from the top. That's all I can add on that.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

The Kebaowek community, which is in my riding and took this case to court, also lamented the fact that many fake indigenous people are often used to portray first nations' consensus.

Are you concerned this will happen more often if we give full power to the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission? Are you concerned the commission will repeat what it did in 2015 when it authorized the Chalk River site?

[Regional Chief Abram Benedict]

Again, to what I've already stated around process, consultation and building upon the United Nations declaration, I think there are some risks associated with large project development, specifically around what you've talked about. I know that specifically for my region, when we talk about nuclear, this is a very sensitive subject that will have an impact on everybody in this room long after we're all gone.

Therefore, I think ensuring that any legislation and the processes moving forward continue to embrace those fundamental principles and the responsibility that our people have to the land, territory and waters for the next seven generations.... This is something we have done since prior to contact. All of our nations embrace and take seriously our responsibility to the lands.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Meegwetch, thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you to our panellists.

That was a very important and interesting discussion and much appreciated. Unfortunately, we don't have any more time this evening.

I will thank all the members and wish you a good evening. We'll see you very soon.

The meeting is adjourned.