Canada-China Relations Committee on Feb. 4th, 2020

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Rees, I appreciate your comment. I understand that, under the circumstances, there may be handling errors, and that is entirely legitimate. However, I want to let the committee and all the other committees know that I am making it my duty to preserve and defend the French language. At every opportunity, I will raise the flag to ensure that this request and rule in Canada is respected.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

We will now continue with Mr. Oliphant.

[Rob Oliphant, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Mr. Chair, may I ask that all the committee members return to the clerk their English copy of this document and that we continue with the two others until the document in question has been made available in French? It is not acceptable to have a document only in English.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Are we agreed to give the clerk copies of the document that was distributed only in English?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

We're agreed on that, then. Thank you.

Mr. Albas, is this another point of order?

[Dan Albas, Conservative, Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC]

I would just raise that there's an expectation that, when witnesses come, we try to have this. When it's the Government of Canada, and these are obviously documents that have been well vetted and whatnot, they should be sent ahead of time to make sure this doesn't happen. I do expect the Government of Canada to be able to meet our own standards here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Thank you very much.

We'll begin with the questions.

Mr. Warkentin, go ahead for six minutes.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

Thank you.

I appreciate your coming today. I appreciate your opening statement. We'll have a few questions for you.

Obviously we've talked broadly about the extradition process, but the extradition process in Canada is highlighted because of one case in particular, that of Ms. Meng, whom the majority of Canadians have heard of and a significant number of Canadians have opinions on.

I just want to clarify that in terms of her case, we are effectively at phase two of the process. Am I correct in that?

[Janet Henchey]

That's correct.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

Up until now, just to clarify, the process has been undertaken without any ministerial intervention. Is that correct?

[Janet Henchey]

The ministerial aspect of it is delegated to officials, and officials have conducted the analysis that led to the authority to arrest and the authority to proceed.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

So your testimony here today is that no government political intervention has been undertaken in the process up until this point.

[Janet Henchey]

I can indicate that the authority to arrest and the authority to proceed were issued by officials without consultation directly with politicians.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

John Manley, the former Liberal minister, has spoken about his opinion that a prisoner exchange should be undertaken in this case. Has your department ever advised the government in consideration of any prisoner exchange at any point in history that you know of?

[Janet Henchey]

I can't testify to legal advice, but I can tell you that prisoner exchanges are a matter for the Department of Public Safety.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

Your department, I would assume, would be consulted with regard to the legalities of such a suggestion. I would be curious, and I appreciate that the final decision would rest with them or that the request would rest with them, but has your department, to your knowledge, ever been consulted with regard to a suggestion of a prisoner exchange?

[Janet Henchey]

I repeat that I can't discuss legal advice.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

In this case, who would suggest a prisoner exchange? You say it would be the Department of Public Safety. If a prisoner exchange was contemplated in a hypothetical case, who would initiate that discussion within government? These things don't just materialize. Somebody would suggest it. Where would that come from?

[Janet Henchey]

There is a piece of legislation related to the transfer of offenders. It applies to circumstances in which people are actually convicted of offences and serving sentences. That offender can bring an application to have their sentence transferred to be served in another country.

Prisoner exchange as a concept doesn't really exist in the law.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

I don't expect you to give me legal advice in this public setting, but now I'm going to ask for it.

If I were the minister contemplating a prisoner exchange in the case of somebody who was mid-extradition process, someone who had not yet been charged in Canada but was possibly going to be considered for extradition to another country, what legal advice would you give me if I were the minister asking to see if that could be contemplated?

[Janet Henchey]

I can't give you legal advice. To be fair, I have no expertise in prisoner exchange.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

I'm no lawyer and I'm no expert in terms of extradition or prisoner exchanges, but to me there appears to be no portion of the process that would allow for prisoner exchange to be considered for somebody who is mid-extradition. What would that do to the entire framework on which extradition is built? If we all of a sudden started to determine that we were not going to complete or fulfill our obligations under the treaties, what would that do to future extraditions? What would that do to the treaties?

[Janet Henchey]

First of all, the Extradition Act is what we call “complete code”. It has all of the information in it that is required to begin and complete an extradition process. There is no reference in the Extradition Act to prisoner exchange, so it's not a concept known to extradition law. If we chose to put an end to an extradition proceeding in a way that was not contemplated by the treaty or the Extradition Act, that would be violating our treaty obligations.

[Chris Warkentin, Conservative, Grande Prairie—Mackenzie, AB]

What would be the repercussion for Canada if we didn't fulfill our obligations under the treaty?