Canadian Heritage Committee on May 23rd, 2007

[John Doyle]

It's always a tough battle in Canada for anything to get done. A television series, a feature film is a huge climb up a hill. When you see something that's good, you think how all the stars had to line up for that thing to happen. So it does take people like Paul Pope, who was a producer of that series. He's an exceptionally talented and driven person and, as Chris said, a champion within the organization.

There were times in the process of getting that show made where it looked that it was finished. At the highest levels, Slawko Klymkiw, wasn't particularly interested in it. He didn't see that it had any national interest for anybody or why it should be made. It was persistence and the fact that it was basically a good idea.... It was a good story.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Can I touch on that for one minute?

I go back to Random Passage. Here was an example of a fantastic story, one of the highest-rated shows in Ireland in their history. If it wasn't for, I think, Ireland and Quebec, it would not have been done. Perhaps you can correct me on that.

[Noreen Golfman]

That's correct. It was a co-production.

[Chris Bonnell]

It was an interprovincial co-production with Newfoundland and Quebec, and an international co-production with Ireland.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Right. I'm assuming we were not able to do it on our own--I'm not pinning this on Slawko Klymkiw in any way--because maybe someone said it doesn't have national importance, in much the same way as Above and Beyond.

My problem is that we can't wait around for something like The Shipping News to come by once every 10 years.

[Chris Bonnell]

As we said, when the corporation opened in 1997, we clearly realized that if we have to wait for service production we're not going to have a film industry in this province and we're not going to be able to tell our stories. That was quite clear. We've really focused on that.

Because Random Passage was a period piece with a high production value, we were very fortunate that RTÉ, which is the CBC equivalent in Ireland, had the same feel for the story. That's what made it work. More often than not with the bigger budgets, you have to go outside your province and outside your country to get these financing structures together.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Chris, how hard is it to maintain a modicum of infrastructure to do this?

We have a centre in Corner Brook. Let's put that centre on the scale of where we are in the global scheme of things. In other words, if I'm doing a feature and I look at the coastline of Bonavista and I say that's perfect, that's just what I need, it would be a shame to say it's not technically feasible. Is it technically feasible? I'm asking how hard it is for us to maintain this type of industry in the absence of, say, a CBC.

[Chris Bonnell]

Oh, it's impossible without CBC.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

So we can't wait around for another The Shipping News.

[Chris Bonnell]

No, absolutely not.

The other thing that's important to mention is that if you look at Above and Beyond--I'll take that as an example--it was a miniseries. The intent of Above and Beyond down the road is to be a series, and that's huge, because every jurisdiction that has a mandate to develop the film industry knows that a TV series is the biggest thing for developing your crew, actors; everyone is working on a long-term period, and that's the way to give sustainability to your industry.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Thank you. Great.

I have a quick question to John, and others can weigh in on this as well. In my years on this committee--because we did a film study years ago--I firmly believe that one of the biggest things lacking in this country is a public investment in script development. Script to screen is something we need to put more money in, and I guess you're probably a good one to answer that. What is required of a government to develop not just the script but the scriptwriters?

[John Doyle]

For sure. After all, I'm speaking as a writer, so I'm self-interested here. But there's no question that unless the writing is there, the show will never be there. They can take a good script and make a bad movie out of it, but you're unlikely to make a good movie out of a bad script.

Telefilm Canada has been doing some development work. They have a program called Writers First, which allows writers to go directly to Telefilm without going through a producer, to allow for some development before getting to that stage. It's somewhat controversial because producers still feel that if they're not attached to a project it's probably not going to go anywhere, anyway. I think for sure, whether it's through CBC or through Telefilm, there has to be a willingness.

The point has been made before that in the United States, if you want to look at the success of their film and television market, there's a much, if you like, lower ratio of development to production. In other words, they'll develop 10 shows, they'll pre-plan and write scripts and shoot pilots for 10 shows for one that goes on the air. Then when it goes on the air, there'll be further attrition, to what actually ends up going to a full season or just a couple of seasons.

In Canada we have not had that luxury.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Okay, thank you.

A final point...I'm sorry, I'm rapid-fire here because I don't really have much time.

I think all of you have done great things and I would love to have a larger conversation, but on the record. The performance envelope in the Canadian Television Fund, how detrimental is that to us for someone like a Paul Pope and something like the next Above and Beyond, or even taking Above and Beyond and going to a series?

[Chris Bonnell]

The immediate results of the performance envelope really showed that all projects were out of Toronto, essentially, in English Canada. So the impact was immediate.

The bigger issue with Paul developing the series for Above and Beyond was not so much the performance envelope, it was CBC's shift in its mandate or its focus. They won't do period pieces anymore. They're looking at that 18 to 25 audience.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Another Survivor.

[Chris Bonnell]

Yes.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Just a comment for the record.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Very, very short.

[Diane Bourgeois, Bloc, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

Please, I have some questions to ask too. He has had 10 minutes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Everybody went on for 10 minutes...but very short, because then I'm going to give everyone else another short round.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

I feel as if I'm going to be in the middle of a battle.

I would like to say I honestly believe that to rectify some of this, for the record, we should model the CBC on the BBC, and that the government should seriously consider doing a five-year funding mandate, and not just one year or two years. I think that's probably necessary.

Madame.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Thank you.

We're going to go—

[Diane Bourgeois, Bloc, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

This round will be shorter.

[Diane Bourgeois, Bloc, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

I have 10 minutes, Mr. Chair.