Evidence of meeting #47 for Canadian Heritage in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was school.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Owner, DOAHL Academy, As an Individual
No, I have not. That's based on the knowledge of how to go about getting the funding and doing it properly so you are getting the most out of the funding.
NDP
Rathika Sitsabaiesan NDP Scarborough—Rouge River, ON
Yes. I can totally empathize. I remember when I first started my dance training, it was in the basement of somebody's house. Because my dance teacher didn't have a school or whatever, her school was moving to different people's homes and starting classes. Now she's reached a point where she has a studio and has learned that funding mechanisms are available, and has grown significantly.
As a newcomer, as an immigrant or a newcomer in the industry, you don't know, as an instructor or as an educator, and you don't understand the avenues available to you. Thank you for mentioning that.
How were your experiences with your funding challenges, Ms. Reddin or Ms. Fraser? Was it perfect, or are you experiencing some challenges? How could things be improved?
Director of Arts Education, Confederation Centre of the Arts
Although the Confederation Centre of the Arts does receive funding from Canadian Heritage, we are about 35% federally or provincially funded and 65% self-generated. The arts education programs are actually self-sustaining, so I don't run deficit budgets. Honestly, it's the same principles that you put into any business, and you have to be very creative at times. But if I think back to when I was starting the school, it was important that we grew at an achievable rate. Sometimes with younger people coming into the industry, it's like they're going to get this great studio and they, unfortunately, find that they have put more money in than they are going to be drawing out. It's a step-by-step project. For a long time we rented space at Confederation Centre, so that's how we ended up becoming part of the program there. It helps if you do have that kind of connection to another arts centre.
Honestly, there are very few, because we are not a professional school. I can't apply for federal funds for our training programs. We are able sometimes to become involved in programs that are eligible for funding, which are beyond the day-to-day scope for the school. For example, last year when it was P.E.I. 2014 celebrations, we had a great partnership with L’École de danse de Québec, and Harold Rhéaume's company, so we were able to use that funding.
Artistic Director, The School of Toronto Dance Theatre
I think that—I'll just say it—we're extremely fortunate. We're very well assisted by the Canada arts training fund. It is a professional training program—
NDP
Rathika Sitsabaiesan NDP Scarborough—Rouge River, ON
Because you are a professional training program.
Artistic Director, The School of Toronto Dance Theatre
It's a three-year program where dancers are coming in full time, every day, for three years, so there's a slight difference there between that and recreational programs. But we're very well funded. We're about 30% government funded from various sources.
NDP
Rathika Sitsabaiesan NDP Scarborough—Rouge River, ON
Okay. That seems to be also the average from the Department of Canadian Heritage statistics they gave us. It's about 26% government funding generally for dance companies, which are professional dance companies.
I had another train of thought that just left me. Yes, it totally left my brain.
Artistic Director, The School of Toronto Dance Theatre
I can just add to that. We're quite rigorously assessed by the Canadian arts training fund. Our school is quite highly assessed, so we're quite successful. I think the rigour is very important and very well appreciated.
NDP
Rathika Sitsabaiesan NDP Scarborough—Rouge River, ON
Right. I'm going to follow up with your previous comment, because your school is a post-secondary institution where students can go full time. However, how are they getting to the level where they can pursue a post-secondary degree in dance? I feel like there might need to be more investment at the amateur level so that somebody can graduate at a point where they can reach your school. What is the percentage of your domestic students versus international students who are coming in?
Artistic Director, The School of Toronto Dance Theatre
International students, I think it's about 10%, maybe, 10% to 16% max, probably.
We look for really good teachers in really good centres in recreational programs. We know where some of them are. As I was saying, Ottawa has a very good program in the performing arts high school, so we know where they are and we go to them. But there are others out there that we don't know about. It would be really helpful to be able to....
NDP
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gord Brown
Thank you. Sorry, we're running out of time.
We have to go to Mr. Dion for seven minutes.
Maybe she'd like to answer?
NDP
Rathika Sitsabaiesan NDP Scarborough—Rouge River, ON
My question was about dance in the school system, integration.
Artistic Director, The School of Toronto Dance Theatre
There are some very good programs. There's an Ontario curriculum, for example, but it's not delivered particularly well throughout the provinces. It's delivered in some places quite well, and in other places it's neglected.
Owner, DOAHL Academy, As an Individual
Can I just talk on that note as well? Sorry.
Dance in schools, that's one of the areas I would like to get funding for because there are inner-city schools where a lot of the kids don't have the opportunity to get dance. When I go in, I see some potential and I would like to fund that kind of potential. That's something that we're looking into doing ourselves, but it is a program that I would like to....
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
It's a good bridge to what I want to ask the three of you. Thank you very much for being with us.
I would like each of you to sum up the main recommendations you are making to this committee. We have seen your passion for the activity of dance, for the art it represents, and for everything it gives to the human mind and body.
What should the federal government do differently or do more of to be a better partner than is the case today? That includes Canadian Heritage, the Canada Council for the Arts, and all the federal institutions.
Mr. Hines, would you like to start?
Owner, DOAHL Academy, As an Individual
Sure.
The way that I see that working for us is to have hip hop known as an art form that is as strong as ballet and the rest. It would give a lot of the kids in the inner city, in the middle class, the opportunity to pursue that. For example, a lot of the Canadian urban dancers or hip hop dancers go to the States, and they find work easily. It's here that we don't have the support. We need the federal government to put something in place so that they can receive the support so they can stay right here on our soil instead of going over to the States and being used by the Americans to fund their artists. We have great performers and great talent right here on our side of the border.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
But concretely, what should the federal government do that is lacking today?
Owner, DOAHL Academy, As an Individual
Allow new art forms to be taken the same as predominant ones or as other ones that have been here for centuries, and make that a part of the heritage. This is new heritage for us. Hip hop is now an art form that can be amalgamated into the new Canadian heritage. That's what I'm saying. There's Bollywood coming. There are a whole bunch of other ones coming. Because of pop culture, we just want the federal government to look at that as potential heritage as well, and put them in place as well.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
Thank you. I had the sense that it was already done when I was listening to Madame Lussier earlier. She mentioned hip hop as something that is being encouraged more and more.
Owner, DOAHL Academy, As an Individual
Yes, it's encouraging, but again, the payouts and the opportunities are not the same. If you're a ballet dancer you train for years. You can go to the National Ballet of Canada and start doing things here in Canada. If you're a hip hop dancer you can only go to the States. There are a couple of schools downtown that offer hip hop, and then you can maybe go on to do music videos, but the market's so saturated with dancers that they have to go across the border. We want to try to keep it all here.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
Okay.
Madam Reddin, what would be the main changes that we should recommend to the government?
Director of Arts Education, Confederation Centre of the Arts
I really believe that a strong professional level in this country is the best that you can do in terms of supporting amateurs, younger students, and emerging artists. It really does have a trickle-down effect. If there are opportunities for professional companies to engage with local communities, particularly smaller communities, in a meaningful way, we always take advantage of them. When companies are coming through to present on the stage, we set up master classes for our children, to give them an opportunity for that exchange. But there are examples of more complete engagement, where a company can come in and spend a month in the community as an outside eye learning from the community, but also helping the community to see something that they may not have seen in themselves. There's a company called Coleman Lemieux et Compagnie that has done some really interesting projects. The one I know best is the Gros Morne project. It's a professional dance company and they spend a considerable amount of time. It creates true engagement that is a two-way conversation. I think funding those opportunities helps my level of student.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
I agree that to hear from Coleman Lemieux would be very good for this committee.