Canadian Heritage Committee on Dec. 2nd, 2024

[Carol Ann Pilon, Executive Director, Alliance des producteurs francophones du Canada]

Good afternoon, Madam Chair and members of the committee.

I am Carol Ann Pilon, executive director of the Alliance des producteurs francophones du Canada, or APFC.

APFC is a professional association that represents the francophone production companies of the official language minority communities, the OLMCs. In the past 25 years, we have worked hard to promote the exceptional audiovisual content produced by our members and to defend its cultural, economic, identity and linguistic value to the country as a whole.

Our members come from all across Canada, from Yukon to Nova Scotia, including New Brunswick, Ontario, Manitoba, Alberta and British Columbia.

Through their activities, our members and their associates contribute to the economic vitality, cultural life and continued existence of the communities from which they come and ensure that a diverse range of francophone voices are heard across Canada. They produce captivating, original stories for television, films and digital media. Those stories are a reflection of the unique places from which they come, and they enrich the diverse range of Canadian audiovisual offerings. The francophone production of the OLMCs represents 7% of total independent French-language production in Canada. Approximately 40% of programs produced in the Canadian francophonie are broadcast by Radio-Canada.

The role of our national public broadcaster is fundamentally important for our sector and equally so in guaranteeing the development and vitality of the Canadian francophonie. This is even truer in the digital era, in which we now have increasing numbers of broadcast sources, but where regional stories are increasingly rare on screen. The francophone OLMCs, and young people in particular, need to see themselves reflected in these programs and films. For that to happen, they must have access to an ample and diversified range of Canadian programming that is representative of all francophone communities in Canada.

Radio-Canada has specific responsibilities in this area, as set forth in the Broadcasting Act and Official Languages Act. These two statutes, which were updated in 2023, also provide greater recognition of independent francophone production and the OLMCs.

Radio-Canada plays a leading role by enabling our producers to occupy their rightful place in the Canadian broadcasting system and to make the original content they produce more accessible.

Our national public broadcaster fosters the development of Canadian talent and creates opportunities for diversifying the way the regions and genders are represented in independent production. It is essential that Canadian citizens be offered varied programming in the current context in which the audiovisual landscape is increasingly being standardized.

Thanks to Radio-Canada, independent francophone production companies outside Quebec have produced major dramatic series. I'm thinking of the serie Le monde de Gabrielle Roy in Manitoba, Mont-Rouge in New Brunswick and Eaux turbulentes in Ontario. By supporting these fictional productions on a broader scale, Radio-Canada has managed to do three things: it has enabled the professionals and creators in our communities to exploit their talents; helped put the regions outside the major centres on screen and ensured that local stories concerning the entire country are told; and put French Canadian content in prime programming position.

Radio-Canada is a unique and essential voice in the media landscape. In many instances, its regional stations are often the only ones providing local French-language programming. Francophones living in Moncton, Toronto, Winnipeg, Victoria and Whitehorse seek, from those stations, what the major private broadcasting groups can't offer them: specific French-language programming that directly targets them. Radio-Canada is also the only broadcaster that provides a platform for a critical mass of francophones and francophiles both in Quebec and across the country.

In conclusion, I would add that APFC agrees that the Crown corporation's mandate is robust. In a constantly changing ecosystem, its obligations are many and can create considerable pressure. The public funding that supports the national broadcaster is substantial but also commensurate with its obligations. Radio-Canada is a fundamentally important institution for democracy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Carol Ann Pilon]

It is also fundamentally important for Canadian creators.

I repeat: no other entity in the audiovisual ecosystem reflects the regional, cultural, identity and linguistic diversity of this country the way Radio-Canada does. Which is why it's essential that it be guaranteed adequate and predictable support so that the national public broadcaster can continue playing its role in a confident and relevant manner.

Thank you for your attention, and I will be pleased to answer your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much, Ms. Pilon.

I'm going to go to the Quebec Community Groups Network and Sylvia Martin-Laforge for five minutes, please.

Ms. Martin-Laforge.

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge, Director General, Quebec Community Groups Network]

Good evening, Madam Chair, Vice-Chairs Waugh and Champoux, and members of the committee.

My name is Sylvia Martin-Laforge. I'm the director general of the Quebec Community Groups Network.

The QCGN is here today representing the English-speaking community of Quebec, Canada's largest official language minority, with over 1.3 million members. Our mission is to advocate for the rights and the vitality of this unique community. Today, I will highlight the critical role of the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation in supporting our community, the challenges we face and the actions required to address them.

First, it's essential to understand that the English-speaking community of Quebec is not a simple extension of Canada's English majority. We are a distinct and diverse cultural and linguistic community with unique needs. Despite our numbers, our representation in CBC's non-news programming remains limited, leaving many English-speaking Quebeckers feeling excluded from broader narratives.

Our community faces significant challenges, particularly when it comes to media access. There is a stark urban-rural divide. Urban areas, such as Montreal, traditionally benefited from diverse English-language media, but rural communities struggle with limited infrastructure, poor connectivity and a lack of locally relevant content. This disparity has created news deserts in certain areas, where residents are left without access to reliable information about their communities.

The rise of social media, while offering some opportunities, has introduced its own set of problems. Algorithms on these platforms prioritize content designed to engage, not to inform. This fosters echo chambers and reduces exposure to diverse perspectives, further isolating minority voices. Public broadcasters such as the CBC are uniquely positioned to counteract these trends by prioritizing inclusivity, diversity and nuanced reporting at the regional and local levels.

Public broadcasting plays an essential role in our democracy. The CBC network isn't just a broadcaster; it's an essential platform in promoting informed citizenship and inclusive discourse. Public broadcasters reinforce democracy by providing independent information, promoting pluralism and holding leaders accountable for their actions. To paraphrase political scientist Loïc Blondiaux, democracy isn't about voting; it's about the debate that precedes it. The CBC has always served as a forum in Canada, a public space for conducting informed debate and sharing values.

However, challenges arise when the CBC operates like a commercial broadcaster, focusing on ratings rather than its public mandate. Centralized programming decisions made in Toronto have often overlooked the needs and aspirations of English-speaking Quebeckers. This disconnect undermines CBC's potential to be a bridge between communities.

At this critical juncture, we must take decisive action to strengthen CBC's role as a public broadcaster. This includes refocusing the CBC to ensure that it is prioritizing resources to serve minority communities effectively; prioritizing local and regional content to see to it that CBC is producing and amplifying stories that reflect the diversity of English-speaking Quebec; investing in rural and remote community infrastructure to bridge the urban-rural divide by improving connectivity and access to localized talent and content; and fostering collaboration to build stronger partnerships between CBC and community organizations such as Y4Y—our youth group—the Quebec Anglophone Heritage Network and, of course, QCGN.

In conclusion, CBC is more than just a broadcaster. It is a cornerstone of our cultural and democratic fabric. For the English-speaking community of Quebec, CBC is a lifeline, connecting isolated communities, amplifying minority voices and fostering informed citizenship.

Let us ensure that CBC continues to serve as an agora for all Canadians, a place where all voices are heard, stories are shared and debates shape our future.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much, Ms. Martin-Laforge.

I'm going to have to suspend, guys, because we have Madame Charette ready to come on. We're going to try one more time with her. If she cannot connect with us, we're going to move on with the question and answer period.

We'll suspend.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

We'll now begin with Madame Charette for five minutes. I'll give you a 30-second shout-out.

Please begin.

[Annick Charette, President, Fédération nationale des communications et de la culture]

Good afternoon, everyone.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for inviting me to present the views of our organization on these issues.

My name is Annick Charette, and I am president of the Fédération nationale des communications et de la culture, or FNCC.

First of all, I have found it hard to understand the exact issue regarding the hundreds of job cuts at CBC/Radio-Canada. The staff numbers that we have for the previous year are as follows: a total of 141 employees have lost their jobs, and 205 vacant positions have been abolished, for a total of 346 positions out of CBC/Radio-Canada's total staff across the country.

In the current environment, these job cuts are having a greater impact on the workloads of the remaining teams than on the services provided to the public. However, we mustn't downplay the effects of the policy of always doing more with less. We're seeing rising stress levels, heavier workloads, extended work schedules and, in the case of news, difficulty covering increasingly large areas with minimum staff.

Radio-Canada workers are devoted professionals. They are committed to serving the public with a high level of commitment. Above all, they are proud to work for Canada's public media service because they believe Radio-Canada is a national treasure.

That being said, we should be discussing the very essence of that public service.

Radio-Canada belongs to Canadians as a result of a social contract established nearly 100 years ago. Radio-Canada's mission is to represent the essence and values of Canada to its population, to guarantee them access to high-quality information across the country and to reach the most remote Canadian homes to create a window on this exceptional country, which extends across 6 time zones and approximately 9,980,000 square kilometers. No other broadcaster can carry out this mandate; no social network has this mission to devote itself to the Canadian people and to reflect their reality.

Now more than ever, the public broadcaster has a role to play in holding together the society in which we live. It must be the mirror and mouthpiece of diversity, of what distinguishes us and what should unite us in the globalization of markets and the hyper-predominance of the American standardization of all audiovisual product consumption models.

Are we, as a society, prepared to abandon the representation of our reality and cultural identity, those of both Quebec and Canada, to the moods of the private sector's economic interests or those of multinational corporations such as Netflix and Disney? That's the question we have to ask ourselves in considering the value of CBC/Radio-Canada.

Are we prepared to erase the specificity of Canadian and Quebec culture in the digital space?

Local news across the country is doing the best it can as it deals with a 70% decline in advertising revenue. Tens of newspapers are shutting down, and radio and television networks are reducing their coverage, thus resulting in declining traditional revenues.

In the circumstances, it's both unrealistic and irresponsible to make private-sector newsrooms responsible for covering all of Canada. News wastelands extend across the entire country, and CBC/Radio-Canada is the only player that can halt their advance. Well-informed citizens are the foundation of a solid and enlightened democracy.

That said, is everything perfect at our public broadcaster? The obvious answer is no. The same is true of any public broadcaster around the world. That mission and ambition can't be achieved without relying on guiding principles such as independence and transparency, or without the support of stable, multi-year funding that guarantees the broadcaster's ability to project itself into the future.

Today's media world is characterized by an overabundance of available content, growing competitive pressures and globalized supply. The considerable importance of CBC/Radio-Canada in the audiovisual content production ecosystem must not be underestimated. To undermine our public service broadcaster is to endanger many media industry players, content producers, artists, craftspeople and workers who earn a living from it.

In its present form, practices and way of doing things, can Radio-Canada meet the present challenges and new paradigms that define its sphere of action? That's a good question. Is the implicit social contract with the public still valid? We perceive a growing distance between Radio-Canada and the public, even more so from its young audience, despite its attempts to draw closer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Annick Charette]

We think that social contract should be renewed by updating the conditions of the broadcaster's existence so that it meets certain expectations and still has its special role to play. We at the FNCC are more than ever convinced that the Canadian people must have access to a strong and adequately funded public service broadcaster.

Canada allocates $33 per inhabitant to the funding of the public broadcaster, whereas the global average is $88. We're second last in this category among the G7 countries. We need to reflect on that because, otherwise, tomorrow we will no longer be Canadians staring at our screens; we will be an audience that's being offered to the people of California, whose interests—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Please wrap up, Ms. Charette.

[Annick Charette]

Thank you for listening.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You can elaborate in the question and answer segment. Thank you.

We begin a six-minute round. For the Conservatives, we have Kevin Waugh.

Kevin, you have six minutes.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for coming.

Last night I was flipping around the channels, and I ran across PBS Detroit. They were doing a fundraiser celebrating Willie Nelson's 90th birthday. Believe it or not, Canadians were going on with their wallets and their credit cards, supporting PBS TV out of Detroit. They were very supportive. They have several programs. In fact, I watch PBS Detroit here in Saskatchewan.

I don't have to tell you that ethnic media is also exploding in Canada right now. Their voices are not heard, so what do they do? They don't have their hands out to the federal government; instead, they have worked very hard with their communities to have their voices heard through ethnic media.

I point out, Ms. Kolt, that APTN television was started back in 1992. Why? It was because the public broadcaster did not at all fit the indigenous programming needs, so, in 1992, APTN started. We are paying for it today, a subscription out of our cable.

In Saskatchewan, we have Missinipi radio out of La Ronge. They are doing very well in La Ronge. They are broadcasting northern stories.

In Saskatchewan, I know of at least four indigenous groups that want to apply to the CRTC to also have community radio without subsidies from the federal government.

Ms. Colt, what are your thoughts on that? Others don't wait for the federal government to hand over more money. I've talked about three or four instances in which ethnic and indigenous groups have gone ahead themselves, raised the money, and have a voice in their communities. What are your thoughts on that, coming from Flin Flon?

[Crystal Kolt]

I am very familiar with those radio stations, as well as another one in Flin Flon, Thompson and The Pas, called Arctic Radio, which we take advantage of and we absolutely love.

What I am talking about is what I need with the CBC. I need to be able to get my stories further than my own communities or northern rural areas. There are things that are happening across the country that I think will be missed if they are exclusively with the smaller networks.

One of the reasons I was so involved with Culture Days is that I need to be able to hear what's happening more broadly than within my own regions of northern Manitoba and northern Saskatchewan. That has been something I need.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

I understand that.

Ms. Tait, last week.... They can't keep a reporter in northern Manitoba, yet the CBC went to the federal government needing $42 million extra because of being contractually obligated to pay. Half of the $42 million went to performance pay.

Would you say that CBC has a problem with grossly mismanaging its budget, in that the offices in Winnipeg and the offices in Toronto are swelling with executives and not putting people where they should? I see last week that they made a big announcement about hiring 25 more regional and local reporters. For me, take down the executives and put reporters in rural areas like yours, where they are needed more than ever.

Could I have your thoughts on that, Ms. Kolt? We've seen an explosion of executives and [Inaudible—Editor] not going to where it should be, as many of the groups here have talked about today, in rural Canada.

[Crystal Kolt]

As I said in my speech, I feel that everybody has to be accountable—a business is a business—so that is something I feel strongly about. However, I do feel that, come what may, we need to have the support to have not only the journalists sprinkled across our country, where needed, but also the supports.

We had a person by the name of Mark Szyszlo, who was a journalist in northern Manitoba—I don't know if it was for a decade—and it was this wonderful, amazingly supportive network—

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

That's the problem with CBC. They do not fill needs. When he left, there was a vacancy, and they didn't fill it right away—

[Crystal Kolt]

I would like—

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Ms. Martin-Laforge, do massive bonuses strengthen access to media, as you were saying? Here we had the massive bonuses, with over $18 million handed out. Did that help anything in media?

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

We're not here—

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Well, we are here to talk about it.

[Sylvia Martin-Laforge]

We are, but I would say to you that the QCGN is not here to talk about massive bonuses and operations. We're here to talk about an investment in the vitality of both the English-speaking community and the French-speaking community, as Ms. Kolt was talking about.

Changes in operations and changes in the governance of CBC/Radio-Canada are certainly on the table, but they have to be on the table in terms of implementing what is needed in our communities and across the land.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

I think I'm out of time. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

I'll next go to the Liberals for six minutes.

Anju Dhillon, you have six minutes.