Canadian Heritage Committee on July 26th, 2022

[Isabelle Mondou]

As my colleague mentioned, in theory, organizations are now required to report sexual assault cases to us. Could we have been more proactive in asking them if they had something new? Perhaps we could have. However, they do have an obligation to contact us, because they are the ones who have the information. When there is new information, it's up to them to contact us.

In the future, new obligations may be added to agreements to make the level of disclosure expected of organizations even more accurate. This is one of the measures announced by the Minister St‑Onge.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much. That's the end of this round, Ms. Larouche.

We're going to Peter Julian for six minutes.

Go ahead, Peter.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

More and more, I'm getting the feeling that Sport Canada failed in its duty to protect athletes and other victims. I have to say, people's frustration is growing, and Canadians are losing confidence in the organization.

Mr. Ruest, you said earlier that staff at the office of the Minister of Sport were probably notified once Sport Canada was made aware of the allegations of gang sexual assault.

Who at the minister's office was notified?

[Michel Ruest]

I don't know the answer to that.

At Sport Canada, the disclosure process is as follows: the analyst informs the director general, and statistics are provided to those in high-level positions. I can't speculate as to what discussions may have taken place.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

Who should the committee call to answer that question? Who should know which person notified staff at the minister's office?

[Isabelle Mondou]

That was before my time, but my understanding from my colleague's remarks is this.

What I understand is that what was communicated to the minister's office was the data about the number of cases that had been reported, not necessarily the specifics of the cases. That's my understanding from my colleague's testimony.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

He said that staff at the minister's office were probably notified.

It would be helpful to know who was notified. If you aren't able to answer these questions now, the committee would like the answers in the next few days.

My second question is about cases of sexual assault. Many people were victimized. The situation is very serious. At this point, every national sport organization is supposed to have a harassment prevention program in place, including an independent authority to handle complaints and an independent process to address cases of abuse.

How many national sport organizations have those measures in place?

[Michel Ruest]

It's a condition of funding, so it's something all organizations have to report on every year.

We recently began a validation process to see where things really stood. The results are expected to come in later this year, but—

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

You don't know, then. You don't know how many national organizations have—

[Michel Ruest]

No.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

For 20 years—

[Michel Ruest]

Every organization has to have the measures in place in order to receive funding.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

I know they are supposed to, but you just told me that you were waiting for verification as to whether the measures were in place.

[Michel Ruest]

No, what I said was that the organizations had to have the measures in place in order to receive funding, and that we had initiated a validation process to see whether we could do even more and where there might be implementation gaps.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

You're telling me that all 60 organizations have introduced an independent authority to handle complaints and an independent process to address harassment. They all have those measures in place.

Is that correct?

[Michel Ruest]

Our contribution agreements stipulate that complainants must have access to a third party to review complaints and conduct investigations as needed. That is the requirement we are examining.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

I understand the requirement. What I'm wondering is how Sport Canada is going about verifying that.

An organization can say that it has fully implemented the requirement, but it's obvious that Hockey Canada failed in its duty repeatedly.

How did Sport Canada make sure that every organization implemented everything it was supposed to in order to receive funding?

[Michel Ruest]

The organizations have the measures in place.

Are they as effective as they should be? That is what we are trying to find out.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

That wasn't my question.

My question is very simple. How is Sport Canada verifying that all of these measures were put in place?

[Michel Ruest]

The organizations report on the requirements in the contribution agreements annually.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

You aren't doing any checks. That's my point.

As long as an organization says that it did everything it was supposed to, it gets the funding. Sport Canada doesn't have a verification process.

Is that correct?

[Michel Ruest]

That's what we are in the process of setting up.

[Peter Julian, NDP, New Westminster—Burnaby, BC]

I see.

I think that, right there, is the problem.

I think it's fair to say that Canadians have lost confidence. They've lost confidence in Hockey Canada. They're losing confidence in Sport Canada because we're not seeing the kind of attentive follow-up that would mean that these policies that are put into place are more than just vague words. That's why we're seeing the number of victims who have come forward.

We're certainly seeing that with 300 gymnasts. We're seeing that with the two dozen academics who wrote to this committee today saying that things need to fundamentally change to protect athletes and to protect other victims from sexual abuse, from sexual assault.

We're seeing a reaction from the Canadian public, and it is profoundly disturbing to me to see that in a case of a serious sexual assault, it's unclear what the follow-up was. As Mr. Nater said, the financing just kept coming to Hockey Canada.

Why have you not put into place obligatory policies to ensure that financing is dependent and verified to ensure that all these practices are followed through with every one of the national sports organizations?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

I think we no longer have time for that answer. Someone may want to follow up on that in the next round.

We will now move to the second round. It's a five-minute round, beginning with the Conservatives and Kevin Waugh.

You have five minutes, Kevin.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'm going to start with your mechanism “fair for all”. Well, it's not.

Hockey Canada has a lot of money. They paid probably hundreds of thousands to Henein Hutchison LLP for the investigation. I can tell you that for judo, wrestling and other sports, it's not a level playing field.

Last month we were informed there were 47 complaints filed with NSOs as of June 2022. So when Sport Canada goes through these recommendation, how is this fair? Hockey Canada, soccer, basketball, swimming and other sports have more reserves than any others. How can you sit and tell us that this is a level playing field—because it's not. There is no third party investigation that can pay for softball, that can pay for wrestling. This is flawed by the federal government. I see it. You see it.

How can we protect others who are not in the eight or nine top sports that we have in this country?