Evidence of meeting #17 for Declaration of Emergency in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was emergencies.
A video is available from Parliament.
NDP
The Joint Chair NDP Matthew Green
Even though charges weren't laid, that doesn't negate the fact that in two instances there were people whom police services deemed to be a credible enough threat that they actually went and seized the weapons. Is that correct?
Commr Thomas Carrique
That would be my interpretation of it.
I'm sorry, but I'm not familiar with that specific report.
NDP
The Joint Chair NDP Matthew Green
It's from a joint intelligence group. It has been submitted.
But you'll accept that this testimony is what I am reading in front of me.
NDP
The Joint Chair NDP Matthew Green
Okay.
That being understood, had they not been seized, were there scenarios you were prepared for in which there could be armed factions inside the Ottawa occupation?
NDP
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
Thank you.
Commissioner, I just want to go back to the strategic nature of what we would call the threat from one side of the province to the other. Was it your sense, given your vast experience on these issues, that those were very well connected in terms of information, and that they were strategically planned accordingly?
Commr Thomas Carrique
I don't know that it was well planned and strategic as much as it was organic. I think there were various individuals who were emerging as leaders at various points throughout the “freedom convoy”. I think identified leaders very quickly lost control of other factions within the group.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
When the convoy left after the operation—which, again, I commend your members on—a number of trucks sat outside the city of Ottawa, which caused a lot of consternation to Ottawa citizens from the perspective of wondering if they would return.
Can you tell me how long it took for those to finally leave, and what type of monitoring you may or may not have been doing on that?
Commr Thomas Carrique
We were monitoring those particular addresses of interest. There were a number of locations where trucks and individuals were congregating, and they were under our constant monitoring. I can't tell you off the top of my head the exact date, but it was a number of weeks before we were comfortable that the threat had been mitigated and those risks had been dealt with.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
I want to give you the last word.
A lot of questions have been raised in terms of the trucks that came here from various corners of Canada, and many people have raised questions as to why they couldn't have been stopped earlier. Given that those would have come through your jurisdiction, can you help the public understand what your powers would have been in those circumstances and what your decisions were around that?
Commr Thomas Carrique
Yes, certainly.
As the convoy travelled throughout the province, police officers were really absent the lawful justification to stop them at any point in time. There were no reasonable and probable grounds to identify any particular individual who was about to commit a criminal offence, which is a substantial threshold, as I'm sure Canadians would expect. Although there was lots of information on social media available, there was still the potential that it could be a lawful protest, so there were not lawful grounds for officers to stop the convoy at any point prior to it arriving in Ottawa and getting closer to the point of having reasonable probable grounds to believe a criminal act may be committed.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
Thank you.
I'll take the chair back.
That does conclude our evening, colleagues. Let me take this opportunity to thank the commissioner and the deputy for engaging in the last hour and a half. We appreciate your making the trip from the beautiful city of Orillia.
We'll call that an evening. Thank you.