Evidence of meeting #29 for Declaration of Emergency in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was documents.
A video is available from Parliament.
9:05 p.m.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
Excuse me. Remember that we have interpretation. Please don't talk over each other.
9:05 p.m.
Conservative
Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB
Mr. Virani, I don't believe for a second that the broader interpretation even existed when the Emergencies Act was invoked, at the time of the invocation, for a number of reasons. It wasn't really until weeks before the Rouleau commission was about to begin that we all of a sudden heard about this broader interpretation that had somehow magically appeared. It's really quite disturbing that this broader interpretation is there, and no one has seen it or heard it, apparently. Mosley didn't get an opportunity to have it at his disposal, and neither did Justice Rouleau, who indicated that the evidence he found to support the government's invocation was weak at best and that anybody else could have come to a completely different conclusion. He was disappointed that the government withheld that.
One of the questions I have had for a long time is, who is actually the client? You're hiding behind solicitor-client privilege. Why is it so difficult to...? Is it the Government of Canada? Is it the Governor in Council? Is it the Prime Minister? Is it the Attorney General? In your opinion, who is the actual client in the solicitor-client privilege in this particular case?
9:05 p.m.
Liberal
Arif Virani Liberal Parkdale—High Park, ON
In this particular case, the client is the Government of Canada.
9:05 p.m.
Conservative
9:05 p.m.
Liberal
Arif Virani Liberal Parkdale—High Park, ON
What I would say to you is the same thing I said to Senator Carignan, which is that there's nothing to hide, but there's everything to protect. My job is to protect basic principles about the administration of justice, and solicitor-client privilege is fundamental to that system, as the Supreme Court has opined.
9:10 p.m.
Conservative
February 27th, 2024 / 9:10 p.m.
Liberal
Yasir Naqvi Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON
Thank you very much, Madam Chair.
I want to thank my colleagues—both ministers—for being here. In fact, this committee has gone on so long that we have alumni now coming in and visiting and presenting at the committee. It's great to see the Attorney General here.
Look, every time I'm in this committee, I get more and more frustrated, as somebody who represents downtown Ottawa, by the at times collective amnesia of committee members in terms of how they've forgotten what members of my community in downtown Ottawa went through.
Let me remind you that this convoy, this occupation of the downtown core, lasted for one month and one day. That is 31 days of downtown Ottawa being completely blocked with trucks of all sizes, most of them running 24-7 and billowing diesel fumes into the air, not to mention, as I may remind all of you—and quite a few members were staying downtown—that they honked all night long for almost 31 days until a court order had to be received.
In that entire process, I think some of you may have forgotten that there was violence. There were hateful messages and insignia, to the point that there was also evidence of a Nazi flag during that convoy. People of different backgrounds, especially racialized people, were harassed. There was an order of emergency that was declared by the City of Ottawa, which failed to put an end to that protest. There was an order of emergency that was declared by the Province of Ontario, which failed to end that occupation, until the federal government took action through the invocation of the Emergencies Act.
To this day, the trauma in my community is real. Just a week and a half ago or so, the second anniversary was celebrated, when protesters were in town. I heard from so many constituents of mine who thought about leaving their homes again because they were scared and concerned, because of the trigger that caused them.
While members have the convenience and the luxury of sitting around and talking and debating solicitor-client privilege—
9:10 p.m.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
Mr. Naqvi, just to let you know, you have one minute left.
9:10 p.m.
Liberal
Yasir Naqvi Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON
—in this committee, I do want to remind all members of what a community—where people live, where businesses usually thrive—went through. Any and all action was necessary to put an end to that occupation, not to mention what was starting to happen across the country, whether it was the Coutts border crossing or what happened in Windsor.
My question is this. I'll start with the Attorney General. I found it quite amusing that even Justice Mosley, in his ruling, stated that if he had been making a decision at the moment when these things were happening, he would have invoked the Emergencies Act as well. Can the Attorney General comment on that particular sentiment and how that, among other issues, factors into the appeal that he has filed? I know that he may not be able to go into too many details, but I would like to hear the considerations that he took into account in the notice of appeal that he's filed.
9:10 p.m.
Liberal
Arif Virani Liberal Parkdale—High Park, ON
I think matters of evidence that was used to inform the decision and the timing of the decision are squarely at issue in the notice of appeal.
9:10 p.m.
The Joint Chair Hon. Gwen Boniface
Thank you.
We'll now move to Mr. Fortin for three minutes.
9:10 p.m.
Bloc
The Joint Chair (Mr. Rhéal Éloi Fortin) Bloc Rhéal Fortin
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Mr. LeBlanc, you're the only person here who was in cabinet at the time of these events. Clearly, you will not give us the legal opinion. That's the argument we're always given to justify the use of the Emergencies Act. I would have liked to see the legal opinion, but I understand that's not going to happen.
Earlier, Minister Virani or you—I no longer remember which of you it was—alluded to a consultation with the provinces. Do you remember the outcome of that consultation?
9:15 p.m.
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
Personally, I wouldn't call it a consultation.
The day the government decided to invoke the act, as you're well aware, the Prime Minister met with—
9:15 p.m.
Bloc
The Joint Chair (Mr. Rhéal Éloi Fortin) Bloc Rhéal Fortin
I have just a few seconds remaining, Minister. I apologize because I don't mean to be rude, but I want to know what you remember.
9:15 p.m.
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
You're talking about a consultation. For several weeks, I'd been talking informally with a number of the premiers. Was that a consultation? I don't want to—
9:15 p.m.
Bloc
The Joint Chair (Mr. Rhéal Éloi Fortin) Bloc Rhéal Fortin
I apologize. I'll rephrase my question.
You consulted them because the act required you to consult the provincial premiers, among others.
9:15 p.m.
Bloc
The Joint Chair (Mr. Rhéal Éloi Fortin) Bloc Rhéal Fortin
There were many other consultations but let's stick to—
9:15 p.m.
Liberal
Dominic LeBlanc Liberal Beauséjour, NB
I remember quite clearly. I took part in this consultation with Mr. Trudeau.
9:15 p.m.
Bloc
The Joint Chair (Mr. Rhéal Éloi Fortin) Bloc Rhéal Fortin
Right. We're talking here only about this consultation with the premiers of each province.
Do you remember the outcome of that consultation?