Environment Committee on March 1st, 2007

[Maurice Vellacott, Conservative, Saskatoon—Wanuskewin, SK]

I have a point of order. With due respect to the clerk, that's such a broad interpretation that I have serious questions about it. You could waive the 24 hours' advance notice whenever you have items of committee business, virtually all of the time. I don't understand why you would ever need 24 hours then.

Just to reframe my point, perhaps, we might as well just dispense with the 24 hours' notice. With the broad latitude or interpretation given there, why would you need it on anything whenever it's committee business that's being discussed?

[The Clerk]

You're right; however, under that rubric of committee business, and the fact that most issues that come before the committee in one way or another can be considered as committee business--such as asking the committee to consider a motion--Mr. Cullen's motion would fall under that rubric of committee business, allowing for the committee to consider it. In order to put a committee business item on, usually we would....

Mr. McGuinty provided the notice, and therefore it became an item for committee business. But since the committee is now on committee business and dealing with Mr. McGuinty's motion, then someone else, another member of the committee, can be recognized and, if they so wish, move another motion.

So that's essentially why. We could view it as perhaps a bit of a backdoor way to get future business or committee business onto the agenda.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Mr. Godfrey.

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

Just so we're clear on this, it's because we're on committee business that you can do this. Does the amendment have to...or does it actually have to be an amendment? Can it be a separate motion?

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

As I've indicated, it's a separate motion because it's a separate issue.

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Right. It does seem to be stretching the notion of a friendly amendment.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Mr. Warawa is next.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

You know, I don't want to belabour this, but I think the point is that it is a separate motion, a separate issue, so we need to respect the 24 hours. This is bringing up a new issue.

I'm not opposed to it--in fact I would support it--but the issue that has been brought up by Mr. Vellacott is that it's a new issue and therefore should require 24 hours' notice.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Mr. Cullen, obviously you've heard the debate here and the discussion. Would you be inclined to provide notice and have the motion discussed at the next meeting? What's your view on that?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

The initial intention was that this would be in conjunction with Mr. McGuinty's motion. I don't know if I've heard Mr. McGuinty's opinion yet, but regardless, I've heard the committee's opinion that it's stretching the bounds of a friendly amendment.

The problem with waiting...because there is a precedent for this. We have done this before during committee business.

This motion is not extensive or long or complicated. It's very direct, and it's based on a very serious letter from the Auditor General of Canada, not--

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

But on the point of order, the answer is no, in your case?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Correct.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

I don't think Mr. Warawa was on a point of order but on a point of debate. As I understood it, Mr. Vellacott had raised the point of order.

Mr. Warawa, and then Mr. Bigras.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Can I propose a solution, Mr. Chair? If you sought unanimous consent, then we could move forward. I think you may find unanimous consent that the motion be dealt with today; otherwise, the 24 hours should stay.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

If the advice I was receiving was that it was required, then I would see the need to seek that. But I'm prepared to rule—although reluctantly, you'll be pleased to hear—based upon the advice of the clerk, that it is receivable today under committee business.

I'm prepared to seek that. I made a ruling, I agree, but I'd love to have the support of the committee for that decision.

Mr. Bigras.

[Bernard Bigras, Bloc, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

I think it's pretty clear that this friendly amendment bears no relation to the initial motion. We could discuss this if Mr. Cullen introduces his motion later, but perhaps we should rule immediately on Mr. McGuinty's motion. We could either vote on, or debate, this matter and subsequently, we could decide if notice must be given or if Mr. Cullen can in fact introduce his motion. I think it would be simpler to dispense with Mr. McGuinty's motion immediately.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Thank you, Mr. Bigras, for that excellent suggestion.

Clearly, I think that's our best course of action at this time. We could start by debating Mr. McGuinty's motion and move on to Mr. Cullen's motion later.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Okay. We're going to consider first Mr. McGuinty's motion and then turn to Mr. Cullen's motion, both under committee business.

Mr. Warawa is first, and then Mr. McGuinty.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Speaking to the motion from Mr. McGuinty, I would ask for a friendly amendment—and it is truly a friendly amendment. If, after “Supplementary Estimates”, it would read “and Main Estimates”, would he accept that?

It would read: “That with regard to a committee study of the Supplementary Estimates and Main Estimates for the fiscal year 2006-2007, the Minister of the Environment be invited to appear.”

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Mr. Chair—

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Well, Mr. McGuinty is next, and I don't hear you saying “point of order”.

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

Apparently I've been tasked with this. I'm his lawyer.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

Can I hear the words?

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

The question, and it's a friendly question, is simply—

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Geoff Regan]

That's a point of order.