Environment Committee on April 1st, 2008

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Chair. Absolutely.

Again, I attempted to introduce this motion the first time and was interrupted on the point of order. We've worked together for some time on trying to improve the state of the environment and the condition of the government's treatment of the environment, and I think you've handled yourself under the circumstances very capably and ably.

I'm not sure what Mr. Watson is hoping to contribute.

The motion I've put forward to the committee is as follows: that there be a maximum time limit of two minutes' debate per member of Parliament on each remaining clause of Bill C-377. This, I think, will allow members to put forward their points and their concerns and their addresses and yet allow the committee to get through the work of this bill and then return to the calendar, which, I'll remind all committee members, we agreed to unanimously. We have witnesses coming before us tomorrow and in the following weeks.

I move that motion.

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

I'm going to ask the clerk to get that in writing, Mr. Cullen, so we can make sure everybody understands this.

This was moved from the floor, so that is acceptable.

Can I ask for clarification? “Remaining clause”--are you also referring to the title--

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Excuse me. That should say “remaining clauses of Bill--”

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes, clauses. And are you considering clause 1, clause 2, the title? The whole package?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Correct. Those are the ones the committee is--

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Can I say “remaining clauses and parts of the bill”?

[Nathan Cullen, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Yes, of course, we can add an s to that, because committee members will know we've moved through the vast majority and substance of the bill and we're now in the home stretch, if you will, with only a few clauses to go.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Maybe I could read this so it's clear to everybody. The motion Mr. Cullen is making is that there be a maximum time limit of two minutes' debate per member of Parliament on each remaining clause and part of Bill C-377.

So we are now debating this motion we have in front of us.

Mr. Watson first. Mr. Warawa next. Any other speakers?

I'd like hands, Mr. Bigras.

Do other people want to speak? Mr. Cullen. Mr. Vellacott.

Let me get the names down. Does anybody else wish to speak to this bill? Okay, I have a list: Watson, Warawa, McGuinty, Bigras, Cullen, Vellacott.

Let us proceed with--

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

We have a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Oh, a point of order. I'm sorry.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Chair, we now have a new procedure in this committee, that you can make motions during points of order, thank you to Mr. Cullen.

So I would move adjournment because of disorder, where we have ignored the Standing Orders of Parliament. I move adjournment because of disorder.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Mr. Warawa, I have to rule you out of order because you made your motion of adjournment on a point of order.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

But the committee has decided by the previous ruling that you can make motions during a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

For that motion.

We now need to vote on whether my ruling will be overruled on this.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Chair, I'm not going to challenge you. I think you've been fair, and that's why I called for a recorded vote. Because the opposition members ignored the Standing Orders and set new rules, and the new rules are that you can--your decision, Chair, was that you called it out of order because it was made during a point of order. In the new ruling, the committees are masters of their own decision. And now they have made a motion, and you cannot change.... You've changed the rules and you can't keep changing the rules back and forth.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Retroactive to every ruling that I make. It is simply the rules. The rules are that you can't make a motion during a point of order. I was overruled on one, Mr. Cullen's motion, but now I go back to operating under the rules, and the rules say you can't make a motion on a point of order.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Okay, but the committee, sir, has decided. So what you're doing is—

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

In one case.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

And I will respect your ruling.

What you're saying is that we're still going to be dealing with the rules and we will ignore the rules only if the opposition votes to ignore the rules.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

That's your interpretation, correctly, yes.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

That's fine.

Mr. Godfrey.

[John Godfrey, Liberal, Don Valley West, ON]

I have a friendly amendment, if I could, to Mr. Cullen's motion.

For this piece of legislation.... No, friendly. I'm just seeing whether this, because I think it might be something--

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

I have to go to Mr. Watson, Mr. Warawa, Mr. McGuinty, Mr. Bigras, Mr. Cullen, Mr. Vellacott, and then to you, Mr. Godfrey. Why don't you talk to Mr. Cullen, because he's before you on the list here.

Mr. Watson, you have the floor on this motion--on this motion. Everybody understands it's on this motion.

The motion is that there be a maximum time limit of two minutes' debate per member of Parliament on each remaining clause and part of Bill C-377. That's what we're debating, nothing else.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, although you did also state that this would be the opportune time in debate to express our viewpoint on what precipitated the motion, as well.