Environment Committee on May 28th, 2009

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Yes. What do you mean by that?

[Prof. Jeffrey Hutchings]

Well, to my mind, a political appointment would be one in which you appoint an individual because of his or her political affiliations, the degree to which their activities or thoughts or opinions would be consistent with a particular political body of thought. A ministerial appointment would be one that is independent of those political affiliations.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

That's your personal opinion?

[Prof. Jeffrey Hutchings]

Yes.

I would add that they're perhaps analogous to judiciary appointments, which are prime ministerial appointments but not political appointments.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Is Dr. Green a personal friend of yours?

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

I'd just caution you that when--

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

I'll withdraw the question.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Yes; we're talking about a third party who isn't present and can't defend himself.

Mr. Watson.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

On a point of order, Mr. Chair, your decision in this regard was overruled by--

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

It was overruled concerning the process. I can still caution you.

Even though you guys have parliamentary privilege here, as does the witness, I still--

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Could I at least complete my statement?

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Go ahead, Mr. Watson.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

By my understanding, because the discussion of political appointments is now in play, then exploring that should also be in play.

The decision was overruled, Mr. Chair. It's been put in play. In fair game, questions exploring that avenue should be in play.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

I withdrew the question.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Fair enough.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Mr. Watson has raised a point of order. I do have to address that.

My ruling this morning was based on Dr. Hutchings' opening statement. He was talking about the process of the nomination of certain members of COSEWIC. That's where I ruled. It was grounded on what we do here as a committee according to Marleau and Montpetit. I was overruled by the majority of the committee.

He can definitely talk about the nomination process, but I am just cautioning individuals that, with respect to Dr. Green, he is not here to defend himself. In our role as parliamentarians, we should not bring forward any comments that might be disparaging.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

To the point, then, Mr. Chair, I think the question was based on the witness' subjective perspective, and it was based on their relationship, not the opposite direction.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

The reason I interceded was that I saw that Mr. Braid's comments were getting rather personal. It was about the relationship between Dr. Hutchings and Dr. Green.

Continue on. I'll add on two minutes.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Thank you.

Mr. Hutchings, you've very properly used the word “advice”, I think both in your presentation and through some responses to questions. Would you agree that, by definition, advice is something that one either accepts or does not accept?

[Prof. Jeffrey Hutchings]

I've already stated as such this morning.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Thank you.

Recommendation 1, anyway, seems somewhat constructive. I'm just curious to know how you came up with the three-month timeframe.

[Prof. Jeffrey Hutchings]

Basically, the minister currently has 90 days, or three months, to issue a response statement. Once the assessments have been communicated to the Governor in Council, the Governor in Council has nine months to make a legal listing decision.

So it's basically three plus nine.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Okay.

With whom did you consult with respect to your recommendation on the three-month timeframe?

[Prof. Jeffrey Hutchings]

I consulted with members of COSEWIC.

Basically, what happened is that I established a SARA parliamentary working group two and a half years ago. That working group met and made some recommendations. Then, in March, prior to being notified that I might be appearing before this committee, I drafted this document. I circulated it to the members of the working group on COSEWIC. Then we discussed it in full during our species assessment meeting in St. Andrews during the last week of April.

So it's a product of all of those things.

[Peter Braid, Conservative, Kitchener—Waterloo, ON]

Did you consult with anyone from the Department of the Environment?