Environment Committee on May 14th, 2015

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Northwest Territories, NT]

You have all kinds of activities going on there: big hydro dams, agricultural development, a huge forestry industry in northern Alberta, the oil sands.

How do you envision the future with this agreement? With Alberta, do you see some strong need for implementation of this agreement?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

Absolutely.

Everything is tied to the implementation, and built into the agreement is the process we're supposed to follow with making sure that we meet and how we monitor all the details. These are very comprehensive agreements.

The agreement with Alberta is almost a hundred pages long, with appendices—it's very detailed. It is far different from the one that was done back in 1999 with the Yukon, which is probably a total of five pages. It's critical that we do the work to follow up on all of the detail that's laid out in the appendices, in terms of what is to be monitored and how we are to keep an eye on these things collectively.

I would point out, to the credit of Alberta and the Northwest Territories.... Mr. Fox talked about environmental flow needs. We've agreed with Alberta in the transboundary agreement that the amount of water that would be taken out for human use is 1.9% or 2%, so that means that 98% of the water has been identified to meet the needs of the aquatic ecosystems in Alberta and the Northwest Territories. It is one of the first transboundary agreements to actually do that and in fact nail down those environmental needs first and foremost.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Northwest Territories, NT]

Within this basin, there has been a lot of controversy over the last number of years with the oil sands, and out of that the federal government has established this oil sands monitoring program.

Could you tell me what the role of the downstream jurisdiction is in that oil sands monitoring program?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

We were involved when that initiative started. Of course, as I mentioned, we're interested and concerned to see that it continues, there's a life to that monitoring initiative. We see it as critical, especially now if they're going to add biological monitoring and indicators to that.

So we've been involved, and wherever we can, we get to the table to make sure we have a say. With Alberta, we are the ultimate downstream jurisdiction between them and the Arctic Ocean.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Northwest Territories, NT]

To date, your involvement has been satisfactory with this agreement?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

They've had a seat for us at the table, so we've been able to make our case. As we've done that work, we've also done the work with the transboundary agreement with Alberta. That is a very comprehensive agreement, groundbreaking; we've made very significant progress to address our concerns as well as Alberta's through that cooperation agreement.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Northwest Territories, NT]

This agreement between the provinces and the federal government was first initialled in 1997. It's good to see that in 2015 a number of these bilateral agreements have finally been signed and agreed to. I think the Government of the Northwest Territories has to be commended for carrying that work forward after almost 20 years.

What do you think sparked the work on this agreement? And can you describe the barriers you had to achieving the agreement?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

In the last number of years, across every jurisdiction of the country, there's been increasing public interest and concern about water. In the Northwest Territories we're no different. It was very clear to us that it was an issue.

I referenced Northern Voices, Northern Waters, our water stewardship strategy. We knew we needed to get our thinking clear about water. It wasn't just as simple as dividing it up and worrying about some basic quality issues. It was much more complicated than that. We spent four years doing our water strategy to get our thinking clear. That formed the basis of our negotiations with Alberta, B.C., Saskatchewan, and Yukon, as it will with Nunavut.

It was a challenge. As I pointed out when we signed the agreement with Alberta, in most other parts of the world these issues are either litigated or fought over. We, on a collaborative basis with Alberta, got to the table. It was a process that pushed both jurisdictions very hard to find common ground in interest-based negotiations. It was tough. It took basically three and a half years. We spent a lot of money on this, but it was very important.

These types of negotiations are not without their challenges. We have a similar one—

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Northwest Territories, NT]

I have one further question, if I could. Did the Province of Alberta enter into a public process similar to that of the NWT in developing their position on this?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

Alberta used its own process. We had one that involved, right from the start of the stewardship strategy, working with the aboriginal governments as part of the process, through the development of the water strategy and into the negotiations with a steering committee. Alberta has their own process and they use their own approach to deal with aboriginal involvement.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Thank you, Mr. Bevington.

We'll move to Mrs. Ambler, please, for seven minutes.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Dr. Fox and Mr. Miltenberger, for appearing to help us in our discussion and study of the Canada Water Act.

Mr. Miltenberger, I'm interested in your comments about water stewardship, in particular the 2010 strategy with regard to the conservation of water. I'd like to ask about those partnerships that you listed.

I'm wondering if you could tell us a bit more about those partnerships, how it works in practice, whether it's the Government of Canada, aboriginal groups, or NGOs. What kind of partnerships are we talking about? How do they better enable you to do your work in the area of water stewardship?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

Northern Voice, Northern Waters was a critical piece of work for us and it involved the federal government. I have it here on my desk. My signature is on it and former Minister Chuck Strahl's. It was a critical document that gave us the political licence to move forward. While there are two public government signatures on here, the development of the strategy involved all the aboriginal governments up and down the valley and in the Northwest Territories, plus the public, of course.

It's very comprehensive and that set the basis for the negotiations that have subsequently followed with the transboundary agreements.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Which NGOs would be involved in these water stewardship programs?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

We pulled together from across the country some of the best water people we could find. There was lots of interest from various NGOs.

For example, one of the big ones was the Rosenberg Foundation, which is an international water-based foundation. We had the local groups, and all the NGOs up north that are represented. CPAWS and all these other folks, and all the environmental groups were involved and provided feedback on this. They were encouraging us to get it done. They worked with the aboriginal governments at all their various water conferences they had by bringing forward their concerns about water.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thanks, I appreciate that and the examples. I thought it was probably a comprehensive list, and I'm glad to hear that it was indeed.

You mentioned, Mr. Miltenberger, that your goal is clean, abundant, and productive water. I'm wondering what the overall state of water quality in your region is and what effect the Canada Water Act had on that.

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

We think we still have some of the best water in the world, and we want to keep it that way. It's important for us to get our thinking clear and have these agreements. The world is becoming.... There is a lot of activity to the south of us, as Mr. Bevington pointed out. The Canada Water Act is an important piece and the NWT Water Act is our own territorial legislation.

We need to push all the parties, including the federal government, to keep paying very close attention to water.

As I pointed out in my closing comments, the issue of water and energy are inextricably linked, not to mention that there is the dramatic impact of climate change and global warming. We're in year four of a record-breaking drought up here. We had an incredible fire season last year and we are anticipating another one. We burned an area bigger than Belgium last year, so water is very important. The Water Act has to keep up with the times. We have to start talking nationally about this.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thank you.

Dr. Fox, you mentioned your goals and those of the water management committee of the CCME. They are much the same as Mr. Miltenberger's: clean, safe, and efficient water.

My question for you would be the same. What's the state of water quality in your region, and what effect has the Canada Water Act had on that?

[Don Fox]

In terms of the CCME water management committee, we don't analyze waters across Canada. We don't do that, but we develop the tools that folks can use. The water quality index is used in the annual report. It is used through the Canada Water Act.

For New Brunswick, we do participate with Environment Canada in something that hasn't come up today, CESI, the Canadian environmental sustainability indicators. To my knowledge, all folks across Canada participate with Environment Canada in the CESI program. We do participate in that from New Brunswick. We contribute water quality data. In this region water in general is excellent, and as far as I know across Canada water is excellent. We take pride in that.

I agree with the last comment that we need to ensure that happens into the future, and there are some challenges with climate change and economic development.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

So where do you think that we could find improvement in the Canada Water Act? Based on the comment that you just made, how can the Canada Water Act contribute to your goals and comments?

[Don Fox]

I would have to think a little bit further on how to improve the Canada Water Act. I would have to reflect on that a little bit, but I would say that currently the act does allow for this cooperative approach. My read of the Canada Water Act is that it actually pushes and promotes that cooperative approach. I think that it is key, at least in our region, to cooperate. It allows for cooperation interprovincially when there are waters that cross provincial boundaries and it allow for the federal/provincial cooperation as well.

[Stella Ambler, Conservative, Mississauga South, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Thank you, Ms. Ambler.

Mr. McKay, please, for seven minutes.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Thank you to you both.

Mr. Miltenberger, looking at your portfolio responsibilities—finance, environment, and natural resources—you must be a very busy lad. We appreciate your time.

I see that you've just presented a budget, and if I'm reading it correctly, your gross budget is about $1.8 billion. What component of that budget is for the Department of the Environment?

[J. Michael Miltenberger]

It's about $60 million.