My last question is for our friends at Environmental Defence.
Single-use plastics are often seized upon by the public as being the crucial issue. I can understand a plastic bag that's in the water or a straw that's lying on the ground, but from the testimony we've heard, they represent such a small, small percentage of the broader plastics issue. How do we get at solving the bigger issue of rendering our use of plastics much more efficiently while not forgetting the single-use question?