Environment Committee on Dec. 7th, 2017

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

How the government interprets what the bill says is different from what the act says. My amendment is simply consistent with section 12 of the act. It simply empowers Treasury Board to also provide guidelines and directives on how section 12 is to be applied.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Was that helpful, Mr. Fast?

[Ed Fast, Conservative, Abbotsford, BC]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

You're up. Go ahead.

[Ed Fast, Conservative, Abbotsford, BC]

Okay, great.

I want to speak in support of Mr. Bossio's amendment, because we are considering amendments LIB-3 and NDP-7 together. We have a choice between complexity and some confusion on the one hand and simplicity on the other.

Quite frankly, what persuaded us to support this legislation in the first place was that it was an incremental movement towards recognizing what sustainable development is. It's not just environment; it's also the social elements of living in our society, as well as the economic imperatives that have to be taken into account. Mr. Bossio has reflected that more accurately with his amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Linda was trying to give it more teeth, and I get that. She was trying to make it very prescriptive. I think everybody understands, Linda, what you're trying to do.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I'm not making it more prescriptive. I'm simply trying to broaden the opportunity for Treasury Board to provide guidance, which is what the commissioner has recommended. That's what I was doing.

I'm not making it prescriptive. It's totally up to Treasury Board to decide how prescriptive it will be.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Mr. Bossio, you're up.

[Mike Bossio, Liberal, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Once again, Chair, the amendment I proposed does that. It gives Treasury Board the latitude it needs to be able to look at all areas of sustainable development across all the areas that are under its mandate right now. I don't understand why we have to complicate it when we already have it simplified.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I feel as though it's like operations, not policy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

No, I don't think so.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Yes, because their amendment says—

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

It doesn't add in policy.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I add in policy.

[Mike Bossio, Liberal, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Policies are in there. It says “establish policies or issue directives”.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

It's operations. Read the section.

[Mike Bossio, Liberal, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

Okay. Anyway—

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Mr. Godin is up, and then we're going to end it.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

The two amendments mean the same thing and we want to keep things as simple as possible. Mr. Bossio's amendment does not cancel out yours. The two amendments are saying the same thing. Mr. Bossio's wording is shorter, but it does not take away from what you said.

We are all pulling in the same direction. Mr. Bossio's amendment is in line with the objective that all the members of the committee want.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Okay, I just want to figure out how to do this.

Linda, I think what I'm hearing is that we're going to vote on your motion, and then we're—

[Mike Bossio, Liberal, Hastings—Lennox and Addington, ON]

You mean her amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Yes, it's her amendment.

Then can we move to the vote?

[Olivier Champagne]

If it's defeated, we can.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

If it's defeated, we can. Okay.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

We're voting on my amendment as amended, right?