Evidence of meeting #124 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was fires.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Gerald Soroka Conservative Yellowhead, AB
Mr. Liivam, one of the concerns was that when the houses were burning, they were releasing toxic fumes. Did you have the proper self-contained breathing apparatus to deal with a fire like that?
Canadian Registered Safety Professional and President, Arctic Fire Safety Services Limited
Self-contained breathing apparatuses in WUI events—wildland-urban interface events—are pretty much ineffective. You have only about 30 minutes of air, and these trucks don't carry enough air on them to manage this kind of workload.
My recommendation for all fire departments would be to get powered full-face air respirator units with a battery-powered assist, but I don't believe any fire department has any of that equipment on the trucks. We had respirators on our trucks that had the P100 filters for our crew to use, and that's what the majority of the fire departments were using for that event.
Conservative
Canadian Registered Safety Professional and President, Arctic Fire Safety Services Limited
Yes. The crew we had in there were all NFPA 1001 firefighters. The majority of them are part of active volunteer fire departments. The crew I had in Jasper that night had all qualified 1001 firefighters.
Conservative
Gerald Soroka Conservative Yellowhead, AB
You were all qualified, yet you were asked to leave and not assist with any structural fires.
Canadian Registered Safety Professional and President, Arctic Fire Safety Services Limited
Yes.
Conservative
Canadian Registered Safety Professional and President, Arctic Fire Safety Services Limited
The only reason I could think of is that because we were coming in with another party, they didn't want to have...I don't know— leakage, or.... I really have no idea. They never explained that to me.
They just released my two engines as other fire trucks were coming in, so I took those two engine crews and put them on with my private response for the insurance company.
Conservative
Gerald Soroka Conservative Yellowhead, AB
They didn't say anything about your not having the capabilities to tie into the hydrants or the proper fittings or anything like that. There was no reason other than just, “Please leave.”
Canadian Registered Safety Professional and President, Arctic Fire Safety Services Limited
That's right.
Conservative
Gerald Soroka Conservative Yellowhead, AB
Wow. That's quite interesting. I don't know how to follow up on that questioning, to be honest with you.
I'll go to Monsieur Messier. You spoke about how man intervenes in forests by putting out forest fires. Do we need to start controlling or managing our forests a lot better to clear out the deadfall and make sure that we can protect communities, not just within FireSmart—we're talking about the close proximity—but a mile, two miles or three or four kilometres away to manage the forest a lot better?
Professor of Forest Ecology, As an Individual
Yes, absolutely. I think we need to talk to the first nations. They've used wildfires for a long time. They know how to do it. I think it could have a big impact on communities.
Liberal
Liberal
Sophie Chatel Liberal Pontiac, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I would like to welcome our witnesses.
Mr. Messier, you are very familiar with Canada's forests, including the ones in the Outaouais and in Pontiac, my riding, so I am very happy to have you with us here.
You have often talked about resilience-based forestry. As you say, our forests, including our own in the Pontiac, are threatened by insects and diseases, with climate change being among the causes. You have proposed solutions to these problems that are based on science and experience. I have two questions for you.
First, in concrete terms, how could this resilience-based forestry approach be implemented at both a national and local scale, to strengthen our forests' capacity to cope with climate change?
Second, what role should the federal and provincial governments be playing to support this important transition to more resilient management of our forests?
Professor of Forest Ecology, As an Individual
How many hours will you give me to answer that question?
I am going to tell you about the DIVERSE project, which I referred to earlier. This project is national, from British Columbia to Nova Scotia. We will be working closely with all stakeholders—the provinces, the federal government, industry and environmental groups—to see how to improve forest management in order to reduce the risk of losing large swaths of forest and to see what entirely new approaches to planting are possible by introducing new species that are better adapted to the new conditions.
To summarize, the science is very clear: Our best ally against the uncertainty of the future is diversity. Increasing species diversity in our forests will therefore provide significant benefits. We can do it, and we can use logging to try to encourage it.
Another important point is that forest management is under provincial jurisdiction, and so the provinces are responsible for the legislation and regulations. We are going to examine each province's laws and regulations and determine what changes could be made.
The good news is that a majority of the provinces and of forest industry stakeholders are on board with the project, as are environmental groups. So I think we can develop a world-class project to try to adapt our forests to what is coming.
Liberal
Sophie Chatel Liberal Pontiac, QC
As you said, the purpose of this kind of forestry management is to increase resilience, which is what will save our cities and towns. A project like this has the potential to protect our cities and towns from forest fires.
Professor of Forest Ecology, As an Individual
I would also include our industries, our recreational sector and everything we do. We have to try to preserve these natural environments, since human beings are heavily dependent on the services they provide. You are absolutely right.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Thank you, Mrs. Chatel.
The floor is now yours for two minutes, Ms. Pauzé.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Messier, you spoke earlier about species diversity in fragile areas and about deciduous forests around cities. I don't think cities are considered to be fragile areas.
Are they? Do you think this is an example where species diversity, which you spoke about earlier, comes in?
Professor of Forest Ecology, As an Individual
In fact, cities are considered to be fragile areas because there are lives and structures there that have to be protected. It is very important to take action in those areas first and start planting around cities, to diversify the forests and make them less vulnerable to insects, diseases and fire. These are actually places where action is going to have to be a priority over the next few years.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
Earlier, you said that there were laws that have to be amended, because they require us to replant exactly the same species of tree. Are governments and elected representatives listening to you on this subject?
Professor of Forest Ecology, As an Individual
Frankly, the forestry industry and environmental groups are doing more listening than governments. I have to say that I have no idea why. The provincial governments seem to want to keep doing things the same way.
Most of the provinces require that forest composition be kept as it is for the next 150 years, and that makes no sense to me. There is going to be so much change in climate and environmental conditions by then that the forest has to be able to adapt and change. When I am asked what regulations should be changed, that is the first one that comes to mind. I hope we can get it done, but there is resistance.