Evidence of meeting #133 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was target.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General
Oh, I think I've answered that one a few times already. Haven't I?
November 20th, 2024 / 5:35 p.m.
Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, Office of the Auditor General
For the record, the bankable measures in the current 2030 emissions reduction plan, which was issued in 2022, are not sufficient to reach the target of 40% to 45% by 2030. Additional measures would be needed to bridge the gap.
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Thank you.
To the ECCC officials, you heard the commissioner's recent remarks on that. In light of previous conversations in which it was explained that we are only looking at 36%, which is below our target levels—not 40% to 45%, despite claims from the minister, parliamentary secretary and many Liberal MPs—does ECCC accept the environment commissioner's findings that the Liberal government is not on track to meet its 2030 objectives?
Vincent Ngan Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
First of all, pursuant to the Canadian Net-Zero Emissions Accountability Act, the Government of Canada had to table a progress report in 2023 outlining progress Canada has made towards the 2030 target.
In the report tabled in Parliament in December 2023, it was very clear that Canada has actually met its interim objective scheduled for 2026 by a degree of 22%, as well as 36% by 2030—
Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
Additional measures need to be adopted, as identified in the progress report. That will bring us to 40%. In fact, in the public domain—
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Okay. Thank you.
I'd like to bring this back to normal-person talk.
Do you agree with the commissioner's statement that you're not on track, yes or no?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
The report clearly says that Canada is reaching 36% by 2030. With additional measures being adopted, we're able to be on track to reach 40%. That's clearly outlined in the report tabled in Parliament.
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Can you explain to me why you are advising parliamentarians to say things in the House of Commons and publicly that are well above and beyond that?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
In the report tabled in Parliament, we clearly state that Canada is on track for 36%. With additional measures adopted, we're able to reach 40%.
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
I know what it says, but here's what Canadians are asking. The commissioner, under the Auditor General, says one thing. The partisan politicians who are claiming something say another thing. The question people ask me is, “Well, who do I believe?” To me, it's a pretty simple answer.
Who should we believe?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
Again, the report was tabled in Parliament, subject to international and domestic stakeholder review.
Also, in September the Government of Canada asked the net-zero advisory body. It released a report in September recommending additional measures that can help the government reach 40% to 45% by 2030. All of this gets—
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
I appreciate your bringing it back to bureaucratese.
The—
Liberal
Adam van Koeverden Liberal Milton, ON
I think it's really unnecessary to talk down to and be condescending toward our witnesses.
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
I speak frankly. I'm okay with it. I speak like a normal person.
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Are there performance bonuses within ECCC on whether or not they succeed at these targets? Has one ever been awarded based on the report that was tabled previously that you talked about?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Climate Change Branch, Department of the Environment
I'm not able to really answer that question on behalf of the entire department. That being said—
Conservative
Branden Leslie Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Well, answer however you want to. Has a bonus ever been given?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
You have to let him answer the question.
Continue, please. You're not able to answer on behalf of the entire department.