Environment Committee on Sept. 21st, 2023

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

You can add me.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Of course.

Go ahead, Mr. Kram.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I'm pleased to see how well the committee has come to a consensus so far this morning. Let's see if we can have that momentum continue.

I would like to move an amendment to the motion that is on the floor. My amendment is to delete all text prior to the words “That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2)”. I will be—

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Can you repeat that?

It's everything before. I got it.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

It's to delete all text prior to the words, “That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2)”. It's basically to delete the preamble.

I will distribute paper copies in both official languages now.

Basically, preambles are not necessary for committee motions. If they are not necessary, one has to ask if they are adding any value or are beneficial in any way. I would argue it could actually be seen as being counterproductive in this case. If you look at the preamble, it reads, “15 million hectares of forest have burnt”. It then singles out one particular company and one particular province.

I would not want to prejudge the appearance of representatives from any one company or any one province. If we want to have these people come to the committee and answer questions, it should be done in a manner that is in good faith and not prejudging any of their actions or any of their motives prior to their appearance.

In the spirit of not politicizing this motion any more than is necessary, I would like to see the preamble removed in its entirety, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

That's it.

[Michael Kram, Conservative, Regina—Wascana, SK]

That's the motion. I believe it's coming around right now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay. Let me just check on that procedurally with the clerk.

We'll start a new speaking list on the amendment. Who would like to speak to it? We'll continue with Mr. Deltell and go to Mr. Leslie once we get through this amendment.

Ms. Taylor Roy, go ahead.

[Leah Taylor Roy, Liberal, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you.

I understand the point made. I think, as long as the motion includes sufficient information, that's fine from my perspective.

The one thing that has been taken out of the motion right now is the explanation as to why we want the Honourable Brian Jean to appear. I think if we're going to remove all of the preamble, we should rewrite a bit of this because, right now, it indicates that both CEO Rich Kruger and the Minister of Energy and Minerals, the Honourable Brian Jean, are to explain why their companies are abandoning their climate target, which doesn't make any sense.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

I agree a hundred per cent.

[Leah Taylor Roy, Liberal, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

I think we have to move the reference to the Minister of Energy and and Minerals, the Honourable Brian Jean, to the second part, which is basically to put his name in place of the Alberta Energy Regulator, to explain why there's a moratorium.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

We'll get to that after we vote on this amendment.

[Leah Taylor Roy, Liberal, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

I think that's part, though, of making the preamble disappear. It's to ensure we do that.

[Dan Mazier, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB]

We will address that in other amendments.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Let's stick to whether we're okay with getting rid of the preamble. Then we'll come back to the point that Ms. Taylor Roy raised.

Is there anyone else on getting rid of the preamble? Does anyone object to getting rid of the preamble?

(Amendment agreed to)

Now we're left with the main part of the motion, and the next speaker is Mr. Deltell. Right now, it's Mr. Deltell who has the floor. He can do what he wants with that.

I saw two hands go up. I saw Mr. Bachrach and Mr. Kmiec.

Do you want to be on the speakers list? Okay.

Mr. Deltell, the floor is yours.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Obviously, this is an issue that affects everyone, and we're well aware of that. We're certainly concerned about the fact that the Standing Committee on Natural Resources is doing exactly the same thing. There is duplication, and we have concerns about that.

I would like to move an amendment in both official languages.

It is to replace the words, “invite Suncor CEO Rich Kruger” with “invite Suncor Energy Incorporated”.

We are well aware that company CEOs have extremely tight schedules and are no doubt very busy. That could result in delays that would be in nobody's best interest. That's why it would be better to invite the company itself.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay. If I understand correctly, you want to take out three words.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

I have a hard copy that can be given to committee members.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

You want to take out the words “CEO” and “Rich Kruger”.

[Gérard Deltell, Conservative, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

I would remind you that, last week, the tabling of this motion took us all by surprise.

We've done our homework and we have a copy, in both official languages, of the amendments we intend to propose today, out of respect for our colleagues and the work we do in committee. The goal is to ensure that we're serving the interests of all Canadians. We're here because of them and the mandate they gave us.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

So you'll distribute the hard copies.

Mr. Deltell is suggesting that we replace the words “invite Suncor CEO Rich Kruger” with the words “invite Suncor Energy Inc.”

Let's debate that.

I have Mr. Aldag.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

I personally don't think we should be supporting this amendment. It was definitely and clearly CEO Rich Kruger who made these very clear statements on the direction that he wants to take Suncor in, which is completely opposed to the direction that the organization has gone in for many years, if not decades, as leaders in green energy in Canada. I think we need to hear directly from CEO Rich Kruger.

I would like to speak to another amendment, but I will do that after we dispense with this one.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay. Who else would like to speak to this amendment?

Mr. Bachrach is next.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

I think the CEO is in a unique position to speak to the company's overall direction. My concern would be that, if the company chooses to send a communications person, for instance, or a public relations person, we're not going to get the kind of substantive interaction that I believe the committee wants. My preference is to invite the CEO.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Okay.

Can we go to the vote now?

Do you want a recorded vote?