Environment Committee on Feb. 15th, 2024

[Chandra Madramootoo]

Thank you very much for your question, member. I'll be happy to elaborate.

Canada's brand with respect to food and food production is well known around the world. We have several assets that we build on and that comprise our strength in our deliberations globally. First of all, we have a very safe food supply system. We have environmental controls over our food supply system, which other countries do not have. We're able to use the most modern technologies.

Whether it be precision agriculture, precision irrigation or the best genetics for crops and livestock, we have it at our disposal, and our farmers make best use of all of these technologies. If you look at our production statistics for all of our major cereal crops, for example, we have some of the highest yields under some very difficult climatic conditions. Our farmers have risen to the challenge and have been able to produce for us.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

If you would, could you point out the number one threat to that security?

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Answer very briefly, please. We're running out of time.

[Chandra Madramootoo]

The number one threat to that security is drought and how we drought-proof and protect our crops to enable our yields to be stable during both wet and dry periods.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Thank you.

Ms. Pauzé, you have the floor.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank all the witnesses for coming to help us better understand the challenges related to water.

My question is for Merrell-Ann Phare, from the International Joint Commission.

Ms. Phare, I think you do extremely important work, which must not always be easy when it comes to working with the Americans.

I'm going to go back in time. In 2002, Le Devoir published an article on the 11th report of the International Joint Commission. It said that:

the International Joint Commission was no longer merely providing a picture of the evolution of pollution in ecosystems. The article stated that, in its report, the commission was proposing an action plan on two priority areas for the health of the Great Lakes and St. Lawrence ecosystems: cleaning up contaminated sediments and stopping biological pollution caused by the introduction of […] invasive alien species.

The article also talked about hundreds of thousands of kilograms of polychlorinated biphenyls, or PCBs, and other pollutants. The article reported that, according to the IJC:

[…] over a decade of research irrefutably showed the subtle but severe harms that exposure to persistent toxic substances causes to the health of basin residents. Yet delays were piling up, the restoration of the Great Lakes ecosystem was not moving forward and public health was continuing to be affected in areas of concern, according to the article.

The situation was already not easy in 2002. Since that report was published, can you say with confidence that governments have been promoting the protection of transboundary waters, as well as the quality not only of the resource, but also of the monitoring?

[Merrell-Ann Phare]

Yes, I would say they have. Without a doubt, we have.... I'll speak on behalf of the International Joint Commission. We are not the government. We are separate, but they have supported us in our work through, for example, our health professionals advisory board, which has been doing research all along the boundary on the health impacts of all kinds of different chemicals and situations, etc.

I urge you to look at some of the work of the health professionals advisory board. A number of our boards and our studies focus on water quality and its impacts, not only on ecosystems but on people and—

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

I'm sorry for interrupting you.

You say that there has been legislative and regulatory tightening, as well as positive progress in this whole area.

In 2016, the International Joint Commission created the International Lake Champlain-Richelieu River Study Board. A report was produced on the study of the causes, impacts and risks related to flooding in the Lake Champlain and Richelieu River basins, as well as possible solutions. That affects Quebec, Vermont and New York State. Under the new Canada Water Agency, no money will go to these transboundary plans.

What is your position, at the International Joint Commission, on the fact that the Canada Water Agency is ignoring these transboundary bodies of water in Quebec?

[Merrell-Ann Phare]

The Lake Champlain-Richelieu River study is a wonderful success for the way we can collaborate. We submitted a letter to the Canadian government on the creation of the Canada water agency, supporting the creation of that agency and urging it to focus on collaboration.

We don't take a position. We don't have positions in the way you're asking the question. We do what we're asked to do under the boundary waters treaty, but we are definitely in support of collaboration, particularly through the Canada water agency.

We do look for the governments to support the recommendations of the Lake Champlain-Richelieu River study, for example, as an excellent example of how we can collaborate.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

We will ask the government to support these recommendations.

In the document you submitted to the committee, you talk about traditional knowledge and data collected over generations by indigenous peoples. You say that those are important sources of information.

How did you gather that knowledge and how is it incorporated into your work?

[Merrell-Ann Phare]

I'm going to ask my colleague and I'm hoping her Internet is sufficient to answer this question for us.

Go ahead, Sue.

[Dr. Susan Chiblow, Commissioner, International Joint Commission (Canadian Section)]

Thank you for that great question.

Typically, what happens with all different types of scientific studies is that there's a component where indigenous science.... There are many different terms, but recently Environment and Climate Change Canada has an indigenous science branch, so I prefer to use the wording that government is using.

Indigenous science is included in the report, and—

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

I'm sorry, Dr. Chiblow. Unfortunately, the sound quality is not good enough. That means we can't hear you out on this because of the harm it can do to the interpreters.

I'm sorry about that.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

In that case, Mr. Chair, I could ask that the answer be sent to us in writing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

Yes, if you could send something in writing, that would be excellent.

[Merrell-Ann Phare]

We can do that.

[Monique Pauzé, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

Mr. Sandford, your contributions are inspiring, and you have a wealth of experience. You sent a document to the committee. Your colleague will also be joining us as a witness in the second hour of this meeting.

You say that Canada is hosting the UN water think tank, and you make five or six recommendations. I feel like being a bit of a spoiler. You say that water would be an effective pillar of Canada's foreign policy. It seems to me that Canada should first set an example domestically. Indigenous communities are complaining about oil sands spills. Some of them are complaining about nuclear waste. Others still do not have access to clean drinking water.

Would you not agree that Canada must first become a model?

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

We're really over time.

Mr. Sandford, you can answer the question later or send us an answer in writing.

[Robert Sandford]

We can certainly answer that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Francis Scarpaleggia]

We can't do it right now, Mr. Sandford, because we're way over time.

When somebody else brings up a question to you, you could use the opportunity.

Mr. Boulerice.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Mr. Chair, thank you very much for welcoming me to this very important committee that is conducting such a crucial study.

The witnesses in this first panel described a very troubling situation with respect to the climate crisis that is unfolding. The year 2023 was the hottest year on record, and it unfortunately had a lot of consequences. I'm thinking of droughts, floods and forest fires, elsewhere and here in Quebec and Canada.

Some people have said that the summer of 2023 was perhaps the worst in recent years. Unfortunately, many experts tell us that it is probably the best in the next 50 years. That is not reassuring to us by any means, whether it be for the most vulnerable populations or for agriculture.

Lorra Hines, you have experience in Canada, Great Britain and Iceland. You have attended a number of international conferences, such as the United Nations water conference.

In your opinion, or from what you've seen or heard, how is Canada presented in the water sector internationally?

In other words, what is our reputation?

[Emily Lorra Hines, Director, Forum for Leadership on Water]

I would say that Canada kind of falls into the reputation of the myth of plenty. We tend not to show up even to most conferences. When you get World Water Week in Stockholm, the UN water conference in New York or the upcoming World Water Forum in Bali, we usually are not there or, if we are there, we are not presenting and taking the opportunity.

People still think of us as having everything figured out, which Monique Pauzé has pointed out is not correct. I think that Canada can be there to show that we are working, innovating and challenging the status quo, and also what we've been doing the last 20 years and why it's not working. Yes, we definitely aren't showing up enough.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you very much.

That's interesting, even though it is not very satisfactory behaviour by our various governments, both those led by the Conservative Party and those led by the Liberal Party. Our country has vast resources in terms of drinking water and fresh water, and it seems to me that it should set an example.

During our study, we have talked a little bit about including young people in the reflection on clean water and drinking water solutions.

In your opinion, are there any barriers to youth participation in the water sector? How can we engage them more?

My colleague Laurel Collins is a champion of the idea of establishing a youth climate group.

Do you think this could be an opportunity to include more young people in the fresh water and drinking water sector?

[Emily Lorra Hines]

I think that we need to give more opportunities, especially paid opportunities. I had to work 11 unpaid internships during my undergrad and postgraduate degrees. Too often we link water with climate, and they can become subcommittees.

The Groundwater Youth Network, for example, is doing amazing things with the UN. I spoke at the UN last year with them, but we need a Canadian earpiece for that as well.

Also, there are many students who are currently in water programs across Canada, and they are not being given apt opportunity to start working, so that first step should be created for them. The agency is one way to do this by introducing a host of new careers and young professionals into government and water policy in general.

[Alexandre Boulerice, NDP, Rosemont—La Petite-Patrie, QC]

Thank you very much.

Mr. McGraw, you rightly put a great deal of emphasis on the fact that access to clean drinking water for all human beings is one of the United Nations' goals. It's goal number six. You also said that Quebec and the Northwest Territories have led the way in saying legislatively and institutionally that this is a fundamental right. However, that has not been the case in the federal government.

Why do you think that is not the case? Does it have something to do with the fact that dozens of indigenous communities still do not have access to clean drinking water?