Information & Ethics Committee on Feb. 6th, 2024

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

It's a directive by the Treasury Board.

[Aaron McCrorie]

Agreed.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

When the commissioner testified last week, the commissioner reached out to your department and specifically asked you when you were going to start conducting PIAs. Your response was that you're looking into it, or you were about to start it.

What was your actual response? Are you still looking into the use of this mandated process, or have you actually started as a result of this controversy?

[Aaron McCrorie]

As I noted in my opening remarks, we started the process to do a privacy impact assessment for the entire criminal investigations program in 2022. We're following our internal processes in doing so.

As a result of that, we are now moving forward with the PIA, which we'll work with the Privacy Commissioner on.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

We have an auto theft crisis in this country. It's reaching alarming rates—so much so that the government is conducting a summit, which I believe is happening this Thursday.

The CBSA is in charge of protecting our borders. Is that correct?

[Aaron McCrorie]

Amongst others...yes.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Justin Trudeau's and this government's mismanagement of our federal ports has turned them into parking lots for stolen cars that then disappear overseas. For instance, the port of Montreal—where the majority of stolen cars leave Canada—only has five CBSA agents to inspect the massive volume of containers that leave each year, according to Le Journal de Montréal. They also have one X-ray scanner that constantly breaks down. The federal ports in Vancouver, Prince Rupert and Halifax tell a similar story.

According to Peel detective Mark Haywood, the CBSA checks “less than one per cent” of all containers leaving the country. We're talking thousands of containers leaving every week. Why?

With all the money the government is providing the CBSA, why are you contributing to this crisis—

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

I have a point of order, Chair.

What is the relevance to this study?

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you for the point of order. I think I've mentioned before, Ms. Damoff, that I generally give a lot of latitude to members of Parliament. I expect that Mr. Brock will come back to where we're at.

Perhaps we'll find out. He has a minute and 31 seconds left.

Mr. Brock, go ahead, please. You have the floor.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

His title is “intelligence and enforcement”. This question I'm posing to him is squarely within his ability to answer.

With the hundreds of millions of dollars that the government is transferring to the CBSA to assist you in doing your work to enforce and to inspect, why has the department been so derelict in its responsibilities to inspect these containers? This clearly sends a message to the criminal underworld and the organized crime units that Canada is a haven for this type of activity.

We have law enforcement right here who I'm sure are very frustrated with your lack of attention to this issue. Please explain to law enforcement why we only have five agents.

[Aaron McCrorie]

What I'd suggest is that, in fact, we are a key partner working with law enforcement across the country.

Over the last year, we participated in 14 different joint operations with local police in the Toronto area, for example. We're working very closely with police in Ontario and Quebec to take a risk-based approach to examining containers.

I think you can understand that it's completely impossible to search every single container entering or leaving a port—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Why?

[Aaron McCrorie]

The sheer volume and numbers of the thousands of those containers—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Ask for resources.

[Aaron McCrorie]

What we are doing is that we are taking a risk-based approach using intelligence that we get from our partners in law enforcement—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

We're telegraphing to the world that we're not inspecting the containers leaving and we're not inspecting the containers arriving. That's why we have a fentanyl crisis. We have the illicit, deadly drugs coming from Asia that are not being inspected at the ports in Vancouver.

[Iqra Khalid, Liberal, Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON]

I have a point of order, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Mr. Brock, the six minutes are up.

Thank you, sir.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Go ahead on your point of order, Ms. Khalid.

[Iqra Khalid, Liberal, Mississauga—Erin Mills, ON]

I just wanted to bring up that, unless auto theft is being conducted by surveillance devices, I don't see how that's relevant, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

I appreciate that. Thank you.

Go ahead, Ms. Damoff.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to all of the witnesses for being here.

I'm just going to start with a rhetorical question. I'm wondering if Mr. Brock is suggesting that this software be used to combat auto theft. I didn't hear that work its way into his question.

Trade would come to a halt if we inspected every single shipping container that left Canada. Is that not correct?

[Aaron McCrorie]

If we inspected every single shipping container coming into the country and leaving the country, trade would come to a halt.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Thank you.

Moving on to what our study is actually about, I have just a quick question.