Information & Ethics Committee on Oct. 10th, 2024

[Michael Cooper, Conservative, St. Albert—Edmonton, AB]

You say that, but I asked you to provide a basis and you haven't been able to provide a basis.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

That's two minutes and 30 seconds.

Go ahead, Mr. Caputo.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Gray, I take issue with something that you said, and it's actually been said a number of times at this committee. You characterize this as a mistake. Do you stand by that?

[Richard Gray]

It was the violation of our editorial standards.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Sir, I asked you if this was a mistake; you've said that before. You stand by the fact it was a mistake. Is that correct?

[Richard Gray]

I stand by the fact that this story went to air in a way that it shouldn't have.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Sir, you have called it a mistake. With all due respect, a mistake is when I put milk in my coffee instead of cream. This was a massive error in judgment. This was a previously unforeseen breach of trust by what was once a trusted media organization. You have said, picking up on what Mr. Cooper said.... The explanation given was that there was no intent to mislead Canadians. Sir, do you even believe that?

[Richard Gray]

I stand by my testimony today, wholeheartedly and unreservedly.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

You stand by your testimony that the intent was not to mislead Canadians. Did you talk to these people to get their motive, sir?

[Richard Gray]

There was a fulsome investigation done into what transpired.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

That's not what I asked, sir. With all due respect, I didn't ask whether there was an investigation. I asked whether you spoke with them—yes or no?

[Richard Gray]

I did not speak with them beyond having an initial conversation with the reporter the night that this was brought to our attention.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

You had a brief initial conversation, and based on that, you come to the committee and say that there was no malevolent intent to mislead. I ask whether you believe that, and you stand by it. With all due respect, sir, that is an untenable claim that you have arrived at. We are getting ready here for a carbon tax election.

At the end of the day, is there one thing that you have done, that you have implemented, to ensure that this won't happen again? Is there one thing?

[Richard Gray]

Yes, we've terminated two individuals.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Sir, you have countless other employees. I mean, that is possibly the worst answer you could have given. What about moving forward? That is retrospective. What about moving forward?

Sir, this is what I can say: Why is it that it is always the Conservatives who are fighting this battle? Why is it? Why is it that, when it comes to Justin Trudeau and the Liberals, they are not misquoted, but when it comes to Conservatives and Pierre Poilievre, this type of thing can happen? That is shameful.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

I'm going to have to end it there.

[Richard Gray]

I disagree with the mis-characterization.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you.

Mr. Housefather, you have five minutes. Go ahead, sir.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Gray, when you hire employees, do you ask them what political party they support?

[Richard Gray]

No, we do not.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

Would it be impermissible for you to do so? I would think that under the law it would be.

[Richard Gray]

I would expect that it would not be permissible.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

I understand the general principle that CTV News is not trying to be biased in one direction or another, but let me come back to this incident because I think there are some unresolved questions that I have.

With regard to this incident, did you interview personally the two journalists or the two people in the newsroom who were fired?

[Richard Gray]

No, I did not.

[Anthony Housefather, Liberal, Mount Royal, QC]

That actually surprises me. Have you taken the time since the incident to talk to the two of them directly?