Information & Ethics Committee on Nov. 22nd, 2023

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Chair, when we have an issue where tens of millions of taxpayer dollars have been identified out of a handful of projects from a billion-dollar fund as being misappropriated, and when we've had witness testimony at this very committee from the chair, the Prime Minister's hand-picked chair of this slush fund, who admitted to the committee that she gave herself hundreds of thousands of dollars, this is embezzlement. This is corruption.

The reason there's an Auditor General investigation.... I wrote the Auditor General a letter. Following my letter, the Auditor General announced that, after reviewing the facts from the RCGT investigation or fact-finding exercise, there's going to be an Auditor General's investigation.

After we had the chair of the board come to this committee, I wrote to the Ethics Commissioner. The Ethics Commissioner has said that there is going to be an investigation.

Violations of ethics laws are absolutely unacceptable. We have gross mismanagement, conflicts of interest and embezzlement of taxpayer dollars. A motion to have a whistle-blower come before a parliamentary committee.... Whistle-blowers are the only reason that Canadians know this happened, and to have members silence a whistle-blower by refusing to allow them to come before the committee speaks to a government that is more interested in covering up their own corruption than being accountable to the Canadians who sent them here.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Thank you.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

I'm not done, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

No, Mr. Barrett, the problem is that the admissibility of the motion was deemed not to be sustained, so the motion is not on the floor anymore. The challenge we have right now is that it's not open or subject to debate. That's the problem we have.

There is no debate that's to occur, so I can't allow you to speak any further, Mr. Barrett.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Chair, you recognized me, and I don't believe that the Standing Orders indicate that there's a limit on the time I have before I have to put a motion before the committee, so I'd like to continue.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Hold on, Mr. Barrett, please.

Mr. Barrett, the unfortunate reality for you, sir, is that there is no motion on the floor that we are debating at this point, so there's nothing to say.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Is there a limit on the preamble that I can give before I move a motion?

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Are you planning on moving a motion?

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Yes, sir.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Do you have it in both official languages?

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

That's not required for a matter at hand when we're in committee business.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

If you can move your motion, then we can debate it. You'll continue to have the floor once your motion is moved, and then we can carry on.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

While I appreciate your preference, I don't believe that's necessary, so I'd like to continue speaking to the matter.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

In advance of that, Mr. Barrett, we are going to have to suspend again, because the clerk has advised me that she's not seen this procedurally. I'm going to require that the clerk provide me with guidance on this.

We're going to suspend for a couple of minutes.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Go ahead on your point of order.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Chair, on a point of order, there is no precedent that I'm aware of—and I am very eager to hear it—where members at this committee have been limited in their preamble before moving a motion. That has not been your practice. It has not been the practice of previous chairs at this committee. It hasn't happened when I've sat on other standing committees in the House.

This isn't the first time, so, while I appreciate that there may be an eager desire for me to not move the motion—

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

I'm going to suspend for a couple of minutes, because I do need guidance on this.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

We're going to get started again, everyone.

When we concluded, Mr. Barrett had the floor.

Mr. Barrett, I am aware of your intent to move a motion, so I'm going to give you some latitude. You had the floor. You are going to continue to have the floor, but at some point I expect that your motion will be moved.

Go ahead, sir.

[Michael Barrett, Conservative, Leeds—Grenville—Thousand Islands and Rideau Lakes, ON]

Chair, on November 16, I received correspondence from the Conflict of Interest and Ethics Commissioner—

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Go ahead on the point of order.

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I'm really trying to understand where we are right now, Chair, because I challenged the motion that was brought forward.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Brassard]

Right, so—

[Mona Fortier, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

I have a couple of lines in the green book, and I would just like you maybe to ask the clerk how this is working, because I don't understand. I would like you to either repeat it or make me understand. I'm very confused, with the challenge I did, that now we're doing this.

Thank you.