Finance Committee on Oct. 26th, 2009

[Mark Rudolph]

Correct. It also provides certainty for the provinces who have set targets for the levels of renewables they'd like to see in their mix. Moreover, the public is more secure in their understanding of how the new mix of electricity is going to better their health and environmental outcomes. It's certainty for everyone, frankly.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Thank you.

Monsieur Laforest, s'il vous plaît.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My first question is for Mr. Williams.

Last week in Toronto, the Standing Committee on Finance held pre-budgetary consultations. One of the witnesses spoke of a program which is a little bit like the one you are proposing today. The purpose of the program is to retire vehicles that are about 15 years old, that are gas guzzlers and that pollute heavily. Unfortunately, I can't remember either the witness's name or the name of the program.

He said that 15-year-old vehicles would be retired, but that the owners of vehicles zero to ten years old could register in a program for buyers of second-hand vehicles. This seems very complicated. And the way I explain it also makes it quite hard to imagine. Buyers purchasing new cars would get credits in exchange for their old cars. There would also be credits for the buyers of cars that are under 15 years old. In his opinion, the automobile retail associations could manage the program.

Have you heard of this program?

[Huw Williams]

I'm not familiar with the specific testimony that you referred to. I can say, generally speaking, that all around the world they've looked at programs to try to get rid of high-polluting vehicles. Here in Canada, the government came down on the side of one simple $300-program aimed primarily at 1995 vehicles. Anybody who's retired a vehicle under the current Canadian program would get that money from the Government of Canada. However, there are also a number of provincial initiatives that exist, such as a $1,500 program in the province of British Columbia.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

I'll have to cut you off because I don't have much time. You answered my question: you haven't heard about that project. That will give us some insight later when we summarize the briefs presented to us.

Ms. Deboisbriand, Boys and Girls Clubs of Canada is asking for money to facilitate the prevention of a form of delinquency, so for crime prevention.

In Quebec, the model which has evolved over the years focuses heavily on prevention. It would be interesting if you could give us statistics for Quebec. I don't know them off the top of my head, but there's undoubtedly half as many crimes committed in Quebec. I think we can attribute that to the programs which focus on prevention rather than suppression. And I share Mr. McKay's opinion on that. There are also fewer crimes than in the United States where, once again, the focus isn't on prevention, but rather quite heavily on suppression.

Have you taken a look at the Quebec model?

[Marlene Deboisbriand]

Thank you for the question.

There are only five clubs in Quebec, four of which are in the Montreal and Sherbrooke region. The model which is the most like ours in Quebec is the youth centre model. The major difference is that the youth centre's clientele ranges from 12 to 18 years of age, whereas our model starts at 5 or 6 years of age. Our coverage is broader. Obviously, the needs in Quebec are different because of the subsidized child care system.

The youth centres are highly successful. Despite this success in some cities, we have seen a spike in violence in some Laval and south-shore neighbourhoods. There are also worrying trends in some neighbourhoods of Montreal North. We are working alongside the youth centres on some programs. This very much concerns us and we often emulate the Quebec experiences in the work we do in other provinces.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

That really does answer my question. Thank you.

Ms. MacQuarrie, you referred to a refundable tax credit, which could be good for people with mental or intellectual disabilities. I imagine you have various categories for mental disability, for example, a minor disability and other more serious ones. You said that it would not cost the government that much to implement such a program.

What percentage of the public would use such a program?

[Anna MacQuarrie]

It would target low-income Canadians with disabilities. The existing disability tax credit is already in place. We believe it would be costed out at about $350 million. That is the ballpark cost for it. But I'm not entirely sure about the percentage of the broader DTC population.

[Jean-Yves Laforest, Bloc, Saint-Maurice—Champlain, QC]

Mr. Engelhardt, you represent companies in the pharmaceutical sector, and you talked to us about vaccines. Who does the group BIOTECanada comprise? Who are your members?

[Dr. Rainer Engelhardt]

The membership of BIOTECanada is a little over 250 companies. They range in size from small start-up companies to large pharmaceutical companies. But the sectors that are represented by BIOTECanada cover health, renewable energy resources, and alternative materials. As long as their products have a biological origin and a knowledge-based origin, that's where the members fit.

The membership is predominantly companies. A small proportion of members are academically linked and even government linked, but it's predominantly an industry organization.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Merci, Monsieur Laforest.

We'll go to Mr. Kramp, please.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Welcome to all the guests.

Ms. MacQuarrie, how are people defined as being intellectually disabled? What is the criteria, and at what level does that take place?

[Anna MacQuarrie]

Generally, intellectual disability is inclusive of developmental disability. It's what used to be known as mental retardation. People with intellectual disabilities have rejected that term and have chosen the label of intellectual disability when a label needs to apply. It would include people with Down's syndrome. It is people with global developmental delays of any kind.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Am I correct that you're talking about a relatively severe condition? Obviously you're not talking of just a mild form of dementia or anything like this.

[Anna MacQuarrie]

We leave intellectual disability to our members to define, but we do support people who run the gamut in terms of their support needs. They range from people with significant support needs to people with less significant support needs.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Do all your organizations, though, have one set standard that defines a person as being intellectually disabled? Is there a benchmark? I'm just wondering if it's clearly defined or whether it depends on which organization is dealing with it.

[Anna MacQuarrie]

Well, there's a very broad variation in terms of the impact of intellectual disability. For example, people with Down's syndrome may choose to be with the Canadian Down Syndrome Society or they may choose to identify with the Canadian Association for Community Living, based on their own preference.

We certainly know that disability doesn't discriminate. We know that disability can--

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Thank you.

One of your recommendations was for an advisory committee. Could I ask for your comments in terms of the composition of that committee? Are you talking 50:50 between an organization and government? What is your suggestion or point of view?

[Anna MacQuarrie]

From a suggestion point of view, it could be something similar to the previous technical advisory committees on tax that have been formed, which usually have at least one or two members of the disability community on board. As long as there is some form of credible and substantive representation from the community, we're fine with the composition that suits you best.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Okay, fine; thank you.

Slipping over to the Boys and Girls Clubs of Canada, I was actually a counsellor for a number of years and I fully appreciate the benefit and the contribution and the preventative nature. On the other hand, I've also worked for a number of years in enforcement of the law, particularly in the narcotics field, and I realize that it does take that balance. We have to have deterrents and punitive measures, but without a doubt the preventive nature is extremely crucial.

Of course, we could spend a billion dollars, or two, or three, and it would still never be enough, so your request to go from $46 million to $350 million is substantial. I think you'll have to recognize, though, the natural constraints that government will have, and that if you take from one area, you'll have to fold into another.

I thank you for your presentation. Quite frankly, if I'm leaning in a certain particular way and it happened to fall on my shoulders to make a recommendation, it's an area I feel very passionately about, simply because our young people are the future and the social costs are huge if you don't deal with that.

Thank you so kindly for your work on that file.

[Sandra Schwartz]

Thank you.

I just want to say one thing in response. I think it's important for us to make it clear that we don't want to set these up as competing priorities. We recognize the great importance of enforcement while saying as well that we think more needs to be invested in prevention. But they should not be competing.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

Thank you. I really appreciate the balanced approach you're taking.

I have a question for the Clean Air Renewable Energy Coalition. One of the other responsibilities I have is to sit as a chair of the Canada-China Legislative Association. As such, of course, the environmental file is huge. It's a huge problem, but it's also potentially a huge opportunity as well.

Most of your conversations today were dealing with proposals or projects on the domestic level, but you're working collectively and collaboratively, and that's great. Is there a collective, collaborative approach for the international export market as well?

[Mark Rudolph]

I would submit to you that if we had a competitive environment industry in Canada, we would have technologies that we could ship to China and India or anywhere else you wanted to go.

[Daryl Kramp, Conservative, Prince Edward—Hastings, ON]

But do you see that you are at the point that we can be competitive with other nations in the world right now?