Finance Committee on May 4th, 2010

[Katherine Moynihan]

It is only going back a number of years that Canada Post began to take legal action against some of the companies involved in remail in Canada. The courts have found that, despite arguments to the contrary, outbound international mail was part of Canada Post's exclusive privilege as defined in the Canada Post Corporation Act.

So I don't believe that this change ne sert à rien. It will clarify that outbound international mail is not part of Canada Post's exclusive privilege, which is a view that had been held by many, for many years, before the court pronounced otherwise.

[Daniel Paillé, Bloc, Hochelaga, QC]

In a similar vein, concerning the examples you gave, you talked about a printer who would choose to print outside Canada for something that could be done... I have the impression it could be the reverse. As long as the Canada Post Corporation had the exclusive power, although for 20 years it was obviously having a market taken away from it, that meant that to print the Reader's Digest or comic books—I want to speak at Mr. Wallace's level...

[A voice]

Oh, oh!

[Daniel Paillé, Bloc, Hochelaga, QC]

Sorry.

Would this interfere with the development of batch printing by large Canadian printers, if the Canada Post Corporation were to retain the exclusive privilege?

[Katherine Moynihan]

I would expect that Canada Post may be able to bring back some of the business that could be done or is currently being carried out by some of these smaller businesses if this amendment were not passed, but we believe that some of that business may go outside the country.

[Daniel Paillé, Bloc, Hochelaga, QC]

A good effort, madam.

[Le président, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Thank you.

Mr. Mulcair, you have the floor.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

Ms. Moynihan, it is still your turn. You have to understand our role here. I know you are in a delicate position, and you are here to try to defend something that comes from a political directive. But I'm not trying to draw you into the political side of the issue. As an elected member, I want to get information that is as objective as possible, and that will enable me to make a considered decision. So I have a few questions that call for an objective answer.

If this part of Bill C-9 is enacted, how much will the Canada Post Corporation lose?

[Katherine Moynihan]

I can't answer that, because there are no figures. It is only a risk of lost revenue. Because it depends on other changes in the market. If more remailing companies set up in Canada, the impact could be larger.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

I'm going to ask you the question another way, even if you can't answer me with specifics.

In the past I have held a deputy minister position and I have been a minister, like Mr. Paillé. I know how it works. There are things written, there are documents, there are analyses that have been done of it. Am I mistaken?

[Katherine Moynihan]

Yes, however, because of the situation in this industry, which we can describe as delicate, it is difficult to get a lot of information about this industry. When we talk about the potential impact on Canada Post, we are talking about a possibility. You know...

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

So documents were prepared to assess the possible scenarios. Is that correct?

[Katherine Moynihan]

Yes, and in another way, no.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

As an elected member, I want to see those analyses that have been done by your department. Can I have them?

[Katherine Moynihan]

I imagine the studies will be subject to the Cabinet confidence policy. I can find out, but I imagine...

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

The thing is, the Cabinet in question is asking us to vote for or against a bill, based on information we don't have. It is a great pleasure to meet you this afternoon, Ms. Moynihan, but you are giving me nothing that clarifies it for me and enables me to make that decision.

[Ted Menzies, Conservative, Macleod, AB]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Go ahead.

[Ted Menzies, Conservative, Macleod, AB]

Having been a minister, Mr. Mulcair would know that there is cabinet confidentiality.

If you wish that information, rather than asking this witness, I would suggest that you ask the minister—

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

Mr. Chair, first of all, that's not a point of order.

Second of all, if my colleague is telling us--

[An hon. member]

Mr. Chair--

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

If my colleague is telling us that as a member of Parliament—because he is no more than that--he actually has information to cabinet documents—

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Order, order.

[Thomas Mulcair, NDP, Outremont, QC]

—then we should have the same rights he has.

He's a parliamentary secretary. As we know, they've decided that they're just members of Parliament because the Lobbying Act, for example, doesn't apply to them.

[Ted Menzies, Conservative, Macleod, AB]

Are you talking about anything relevant here?