Finance Committee on May 31st, 2012

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

And does this budget give you that?

[Diane Brisebois]

We felt it did. Thank you.

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

Okay. Thank you.

On the immigration system and the changes proposed here, does that help your retailers or does it hinder them?

[Diane Brisebois]

The immigration initiatives in the budget do not hinder our retailers. Retailers obviously are facing the same challenges as many other sectors in finding workers, specifically in western Canada where there's continued growth. Our members generally were supportive.

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

So the labour shortage is what you're talking about, contrary to what Mr. Stanford said.

[Diane Brisebois]

Yes, in retail. And I know that often.... Certainly, Mr. Stanford commented on retail or added retail in his conversation, but in fact the jobs that are being created in western Canada are mostly full time, they are high-skill jobs. More and more distribution centres are being built in western Canada, as well as design centres, and those are high-skill jobs.

There is a challenge as well with part time.

[Shelly Glover, Conservative, Saint Boniface, MB]

I appreciate that. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Thank you.

I hope members will allow me, as the chair, to ask a few questions. I wanted to follow up briefly with Mr. Stanford and Ms. Rothman.

Mr. Stanford, as you can see, we've had a lively debate in terms of job creation and how many full time, how many part time. But I have to say, when I review Statistics Canada, when I look at the OECD.... You referenced Germany. Germany has an excellent record. In fact, Germany, on the chart I have, the labour market statistics, has the best in terms of level employment rate. But Canada is very close to Germany. I'm looking at third quarter 2011. Germany is at 72.7%; Canada is at 72.1%. If Germany is the best, we're actually very close.

I think we have to look at this on a relative level. We also have to consider Germany, with the euro, and the Deutschmark would have been so strong...it is in fact benefiting from the common monetary policy in the European Union.

In the past we've worked together on issues such as accelerated capital cost allowance for the manufacturing sector. I certainly supported you and your organization for that. But just on the record, some of the initiatives, for instance, the work share program that was introduced by the government, the hiring credit, which was extended in this budget, the measures for disabilities in terms of improving access for people who are disabled in the workforce.... I suspect you and your organization would in fact say that these are positive measures for employment and for the economy.

I just wanted you to respond to that.

[Jim Stanford]

Certainly, we were active with our partners in HRSDC in designing and implementing many of those work sharing programs. That was very important. Our view would be to again expand and extend those measures. The capital cost allowance is a modest positive stimulus to business spending. I think that's been helpful.

So I certainly wouldn't imply that those weren't valuable.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

Just in finishing up, I'd love for you to come out to my riding, because I don't know if I can convince you here. But in terms of the labour needs of my riding—skilled and unskilled, of all types of businesses—unless they're all telling me a mistruth, this is the number one challenge they face as businesses, as employers. So I'd love to have you out in my riding. We could do some round tables together, if you're willing to do that.

I wanted to follow up with Ms. Rothman. I take your point in terms of the challenges of addressing poverty and child poverty, but if you look at the national child benefit, introduced by the former government, improvements made by this government—the working income tax benefit, which addresses the working poor, the investments in aboriginal education in this budget.... I think there have been an awful lot of positive steps as well as, in a time of restraint, continuing increases to the provinces for essential programs, such as health care at a 6% increase and social services at a 3% increase. Surely these must be at least positives in terms of addressing poverty in Canada.

[Laurel Rothman]

Certainly, they are important and positive. If we also look, though, at the proportion of GDP that we spend on tax measures, transfers, and services—and this comes from the UNICEF report—we're lower than we should be, so there's a lot still to do.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

You're saying in terms of taking programs such as the national child benefit and making them more generous, or taking the working income tax—

[Laurel Rothman]

Yes. I would argue that we really strongly encourage that there be an overall strategy enshrined in legislation so that we'd have this on the public radar screen in a more permanent, focused way.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

But the overall strategy in terms of 6% increases for health care, 3% increases for social assistance, investments in aboriginal communities, which have some of the most challenging rates in terms of poverty, and investments in the working tax benefit, which is for working families.... I don't see how you see this as being anything other than a strategy designed to combat poverty in Canada.

[Laurel Rothman]

I guess they're not coordinated in any particular way; it's very ad hoc. So if they mutually benefit each other, that's great. I didn't come prepared to talk about the great details. I'll talk about the CST, which has no transparency. We have no idea whether those transfers are spent as they really need to be. So I think there's a lot of work that needs to be done. Of course, the funds are important, and we wouldn't want in any way to imply that they're not. For a wealthy nation with tremendous resources, we could be doing much better.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

My time is up, but I'm willing to follow up with you on that. I would say that things like the working income tax benefit are in fact designed to...cooperate in other areas.

My committee is calling me on time, because I call them on time.

[Laurel Rothman]

Okay. I would like to follow up.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Rajotte]

I do appreciate all of you being here, and being here by video conference. We appreciate your input very much. Thank you.

Colleagues, we'll see you at 3:30.

The meeting is adjourned.