Evidence of meeting #150 for Finance in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was approach.
A video is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
Our approach is to price carbon so that we can actually improve our economy over the long term and, of course, we have examples to show how this can work. If you look in British Columbia, which has had carbon pricing, we've seen significant economic gains. When you look in Quebec, which has—
Conservative
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
—a cap-and-trade approach, we've seen a positive economic outcome.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
On a point of order, Mr. Chair, the minister has had his opening statement. My question was a very specific one: How much will the carbon tax cost the average family?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter
The minister is responding to your question. I believe the minister is done. The question is yours.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
How much will your federal carbon tax cost the average Canadian family when it's fully implemented?
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
I think as you know, our approach around the pricing of carbon is to make it revenue neutral. We are looking towards the provinces to determine the approach they're going to take, and that, in our estimation, will be revenue neutral from the federal government's standpoint.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
How much will it cost? This bill seeks to allow you, as a federal government, to impose a carbon tax in provinces that don't have their own. In those provinces, how much will that carbon tax that you wish to impose cost the average Canadian family?
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
Perhaps there's a language issue: “revenue neutral”. That actually means exactly what it says.
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
When the provinces choose their approach, from a federal government standpoint we are saying that it's revenue neutral. They will choose their approach. At that time, they will determine, themselves, how they can actually put that revenue to work in the provincial method that they've chosen.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
Yes, I understand that, but where provinces don't have their own carbon tax, this bill will empower you to impose one. Your officials have admitted that it will raise gas prices by 11¢ a litre and home-heating prices by over $200 on average. How much will it cost the average Canadian household to pay your proposed federal carbon tax? How much?
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
Actually, Mr. Poilievre, our view is that it would cost significantly more for Canadians over the long run, for Canadians in their households and for Canadian businesses, if we don't take an appropriate approach to carbon pricing. I will tell you that I've been meeting—
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
How can you be sure of that if you don't even know or won't even say how much it will cost Canadian households to pay this tax? How much will it cost the average family?
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
—with Canadian businesses that are trying to think about how they can appropriately talk about the risks over the long term of climate change and the costs that those will impose on their businesses and on Canadians writ large.
In our view, this is actually the approach to make sure we have a strong economy, which means we will actually be deferring potential costs for Canadians over the long term. We will move forward with this approach, which we think is economically positive and which will help not only businesses but Canadians over the long run.
Conservative
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
Perhaps again you're not fully hearing what I'm saying. The Canadian approach is a pan-Canadian approach, so the provinces are going to be choosing their own approach, and—
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Carleton, ON
Perhaps you're not hearing the question. The question is, how much will it cost the average family?
Liberal
Bill Morneau Liberal Toronto Centre, ON
—the approach from the federal government, as a backstop, will be revenue neutral.