Evidence of meeting #53 for Finance in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Kristen Underwood  Director General, Income Security and Social Development Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Kevin Wagdin  Director, Seniors and Pensions Policy Secretariat, Income Security and Social Development Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Philippe Méla  Legislative Clerk
Selena Beattie  Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat
Karen Hall  Director General, Social Policy Directorate, Strategic and Service Policy Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Catherine Demers  Director General, Employment Insurance Policy, Skills and Employment Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Clerk of the Committee  Mr. Alexandre Roger
Barbara Moran  Director General, Strategic Policy, Analysis and Workplace Information, Labour Program - Policy, Dispute Resolution and International Affairs Directorate, Department of Employment and Social Development
Mona Nandy  Executive Director, Employment Insurance Policy, Skills and Employment Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
George Rae  Director, Policy Analysis and Initiative, Employment Insurance Policy, Skills and Employment Branch, Department of Employment and Social Development
Manon Paquet  Director, Special Projects, Democratic Institutions Secretariat, Privy Council Office

4:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

All right.

4:05 p.m.

NDP

Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC

On a point of order, the reality is, as Ms. Dzerowicz knows very well, if the government provides the royal recommendation, the amendments are not out of order. It's ultimately a government decision that the chair has to enforce.

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay, we've had a little debate on the ruling.

We will go to the clerk, and he will poll the committee on whether we uphold the ruling or not.

(Ruling of the chair sustained: yeas 9; nays 2)

(Clause 276 agreed to on division)

(On clause 277)

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Thank you, Ms. Underwood and Mr. Wagdin.

We will now turn to division 33, the Public Service Employment Act, and we have as the lead, Ms. Beattie.

4:10 p.m.

Selena Beattie Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Thank you very much for coming and waiting through a couple of nights, likely.

Do you want to give a quick explanation on division 33? Then we'll see if there are any questions.

4:10 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

I'd be happy to do that.

Mr. Chair, the Public Service Employment Act provides a foundation for staffing in the federal public service by creating a framework for a non-partisan public service where appointments are based on merit. It gives the Public Service Commission authority to make appointments, which, in practice, is usually delegated to deputy heads.

This division amends the Public Service Employment Act to reduce and remove barriers to achieving diversity in the public service and enhancing the degree to which it embodies the principle of inclusion.

I can turn to clause 277 to begin with, which amends the preamble to add a commitment by the Government of Canada to an inclusive public service that reflects the diversity of Canada's population.

Shall I continue with other clauses?

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

We'll start with that one and see if there are any questions.

I believe we're on page 289, for those who are following by way of the bill.

Are there any questions on clause 277?

(Clause 277 agreed to on division)

(On clause 278)

4:10 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

Subclause 278(1) amends the act to add a definition of equity-seeking groups, which will be defined as “a group of persons who are disadvantaged on the basis of one or more prohibited grounds of discrimination within the meaning of the Canadian Human Rights Act.”

Subclause 278(2) amends the act by.... Did you want to pause after the subclause?

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Go ahead and explain subclause 278(2) too.

4:10 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

Subclause 278(2) adds proposed subsection 2(5), which would include bias or barriers that disadvantage persons belonging to equity-seeking groups within the meaning of error, omission or improper conduct, for the purposes of investigations by the Public Service Commission and by delegated deputy heads.

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Are there any questions on clause 278 by members?

(Clause 278 agreed to on division)

(On clause 279)

4:10 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

Clause 279 amends the act by adding a subsection to section 17, so that the commission may conduct audits related specifically to bias or barriers that disadvantage persons belonging to equity-seeking groups.

4:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Are there any questions on clause 279? I hear none.

(Clause 279 agreed to on division)

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

We're on clause 280—

June 3rd, 2021 / 4:15 p.m.

Conservative

Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC

Mr. Chair, I note that all members of this committee have received written briefing notes that effectively explain the different sections here, clause 280 all the way through to clause 287. I'd be prepared to allow this to go as a bundle.

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay. We'll ask Ms. Beattie to explain all of these as a bundle.

I believe Mr. Julian has a question.

Do you have a question, Peter?

4:15 p.m.

NDP

Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC

It's not a question, just a comment, Mr. Chair.

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay, go ahead.

4:15 p.m.

NDP

Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC

I think that's a good proposal by Mr. Fast. He's mellowing.

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

It's good to see the official opposition and the NDP agreeing.

(On clauses 280 to 287)

Could we get an explanation on the remainder of those clauses, Ms. Beattie? Then we'll go to a vote seeing them all as one.

4:15 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

It would be my pleasure.

The remainder of the clauses will require a review of new and revised qualification standards to include an evaluation of bias and barriers, require the design and selection of assessment methods to include an evaluation of bias and barriers, broaden the preference given to Canadian citizens in external advertised appointments to include permanent residents, and provide for transitional provisions related to the timing and the coming into force of these sections.

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay.

Are there any questions from committee members?

I have one myself, Ms. Beattie.

How do you see doing this? Do you have supervisors over the supervisors supervising the hiring officers? How do you do this? How do you police this?

4:15 p.m.

Executive Director, People Management and Community Engagement, Workplace Policies and Services Sector, Treasury Board Secretariat

Selena Beattie

This will be done in different ways. For qualification standards, these are minimum requirements that are established by the employer. In this case, Treasury Board Secretariat's office of the chief human resources officer, when it conducts reviews, will need to conduct the evaluation.

For assessment methods, the Public Service Commission will be providing tools, supports and instructions for hiring managers about how to ensure the assessment methods have been evaluated and any barriers have been mitigated to the extent possible.

4:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

I see that Ms. Dzerowicz has a question.