Evidence of meeting #7 for Finance in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was inflation.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Tiff Macklem  Governor, Bank of Canada
Carolyn A. Wilkins  Senior Deputy Governor, Bank of Canada

November 26th, 2020 / 3:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

I now call the meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number seven of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Finance.

Pursuant to the motion adopted by the committee on Thursday, November 19, the committee is meeting on its study of the report of the Bank of Canada on monetary policy. Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format pursuant to the House order of September 23. The proceedings will be made available via the House of Commons' website.

Just so that you are aware, the webcast will show the person speaking, rather than the entire committee.

To ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline a few of the rules. Seeing that we have witnesses, I will go through them today. Members and witnesses may speak in the official language of their choice. Interpretation services are available for this meeting. You have a choice at the bottom of your screen of either the floor, English or French audio. For members participating in person, proceed as you usually would when the whole committee is meeting in person in this committee room. There are four of us here. Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. If you're on the video conference, please click on the microphone icon to unmute yourself. As a reminder, all comments by members and witnesses should be addressed through the chair. When you're not speaking, your microphone should be on “mute”.

Committee members have sent me the order of questioners, so we will go by that.

I'd now like to welcome our witnesses. We're pleased to have with us today the Governor of the Bank of Canada, Tiff Macklem.

Let me say, Mr. Macklem, congratulations on your appointment as Governor of the Bank of Canada and welcome to this committee. I know you've been here before, and I guess before most of our times here, but welcome again.

With the governor is the senior deputy governor of the Bank of Canada, Carolyn Wilkins.

Carolyn, you've been at this committee many times before the members who sit on this committee. I know that before too long you're going on to other ventures. We wish you well in those ventures. I sincerely want to thank you for your work with the Bank of Canada over the last number of years and for your appearances at the committee. I don't think any member can deny that your information was always forthright and valuable. Thank you, then, for your appearances before this committee and for your work with the Bank of Canada. All the best in new ventures.

I'll turn it over to you, Mr. Macklem. The floor is yours. You have a number of remarks, and then we'll go to questions.

First on our questioners list, I believe, is Ms. Jansen, followed by Mr. Fraser.

3:35 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

I'm going to be splitting my time with Mr. Falk.

3:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay, that's great. Thank you.

Mr. Macklem, go ahead.

3:35 p.m.

Tiff Macklem Governor, Bank of Canada

Thank you, Chair, for your kind words to both of us. Senior Deputy Governor Wilkins and I are very pleased to be back to discuss our monetary policy report with you and the committee, and also to discuss the outlook for the Canadian economy.

The main message is that we will get through this pandemic, but it's going to be a tough slog, and the Bank of Canada will be there with Canadians every step of the way.

Let me briefly summarize our outlook for the economy.

Our projection is highly conditional on our assumptions about the virus.

We assumed that authorities won’t need to reinstate the sort of extensive and widespread containment measures we saw in the spring. But we can expect successive waves of the virus to require localized restrictions. We also assumed that vaccines and effective treatments will be widely available by mid-2022. Since we released the Monetary Policy Report, the MPR, four weeks ago, news about vaccines has been encouraging, while virus cases have continued to rise and containment measures have escalated.

Since June, the Canadian economy has bounced back sharply as many businesses have reopened. We have regained close to 80% of the jobs lost since the start of the pandemic. But the economy still has more than 600,000 fewer jobs than it did before the pandemic. The current job losses are concentrated in the services sector, particularly in lower-wage jobs where physical distancing is difficult. That is why the income support measures put in place have been so important for the recovery.

We judge that the very rapid growth of the reopening phase is now over, and the economy has entered in the slower-growth recuperation phase. For 2020 as a whole, we expect that the economy will have shrunk by about 5.5% percent. Given the math involved in calculating annual growth rates, we expect annual growth to average almost 4% in 2021 and 2022. But we anticipate that this growth will be uneven across sectors and choppy over time. Some parts of the economy will simply be unable to completely reopen until a vaccine becomes widely available. And some regions that were weaker before the pandemic—such as the energy-intensive parts of Canada—will face greater difficulties than others. When we add it up, we project that the economy will still be operating below its potential into 2023.

Inflation is also unusually weak. and should remain below our target range of 1 to 3% until early next year. After that, we project it will rise gradually. But with the economy continuing to operate below its potential, inflation is projected to remain less than 2% into 2023.

The outlook and the historic nature of the COVID-19 shock mean that the economy will continue to need extraordinary monetary policy support as it recuperates, so let me spend a few minutes discussing our policy response.

We lowered our policy interest rate to 0.25%, which we judge to be its effective lower bound. We have committed to keeping our policy interest rate at its effective lower bound until slack is absorbed so that the 2% inflation target is sustainably achieved. In our current outlook, this takes us into 2023.

Our forward guidance is being reinforced and supplemented by a program of quantitative easing, or QE. I want to take a moment to explain how QE works and discuss the adjustments to our program that we announced last month.

Normally, when we want more monetary stimulus to achieve our inflation target, we lower the target for the overnight interest rate. That leads to lower interest rates further out on the yield curve at the maturities where households and businesses typically borrow.

When our policy interest rate is at its effective lower bound, QE provides an additional way of reducing the interest rates that matter for households and businesses. By increasing the demand for government bonds, QE acts to lower their interest rates. This reduces the borrowing costs for households and businesses. In this way, QE is another tool that supports the spending and investments that are needed to help create jobs and get the economy back to capacity, and to achieve our inflation target. We buy these bonds on the secondary market from financial institutions, and we pay for the bonds by creating settlement balances, or central bank reserves. This ability to create reserves is a very special ability. It's something that only central banks have. That’s why it’s important that central banks are independent from governments.

At the outset of the pandemic, in March and April, core credit markets were seizing up as economic activity plummeted and uncertainty soared. If core funding markets aren’t working, neither is the economy, and we can’t implement monetary policy. So the bank launched a number of programs to restore market functioning, including the Government of Canada bond purchase program. The program was launched at a pace of at least $5 billion per week. Purchases were mostly of shorter-maturity bonds where issuance was strongest.

These purchases led to a substantial increase in the size of our balance sheet. We were able to move more aggressively because before the pandemic, the bank’s balance sheet was small compared with those of other central banks. In the first chart, which we have provided to you, you can see that the value of assets we hold relative to the size of our economy remains relatively low compared with that of our peers.

As other central banks took similar actions, global financial conditions stabilized. This, together with our own actions, restored market functioning in Canada. Since July we have scaled back or ended the active use of many of the programs we had set up when markets were not functioning properly. In particular, we stopped buying bankers’ acceptances. We're not buying Canada mortgage bonds or provincial money market securities. Our corporate bond purchase program has been used very infrequently since July. We also took a series of steps to reduce our purchases of Government of Canada treasury bills in the primary market. At the peak, we were buying as much as 40% of the T-bill auction. As of November 24, we're buying in a range of zero to 10%. The focus of our bond purchases has now shifted squarely to providing the monetary stimulus required to support the recovery and get inflation back to target. As you can see in the second chart, our balance sheet has been relatively stable since July.

This brings me to today. Markets continue to function well. We're providing exceptional forward guidance, reinforced and supplemented by our bond purchases. Our guidance has anchored interest rates at the short end of the yield curve. That means we no longer need to buy as many short-term government bonds as we did at the start of the pandemic.

We've recalibrated, or adjusted, our quantitative easing program. To increase the efficiency of our purchases, we're buying fewer bonds at shorter maturities, and more at longer maturities. This shift is increasing the stimulative impact of our QE program per dollar purchased. Essentially by concentrating on purchase at longer maturities, we can have a bigger impact on the interest rates—

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Mr. Macklem, just hold for a minute.

Yes, Mr. Falk.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Ted Falk Conservative Provencher, MB

Mr. Chair, the translation seems to have been skewed for the last minute.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Can we just check on the translation?

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

I think it was mixed up for a short time there. It seems to be fixed.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Okay, just interrupt again, Mr. Falk, if there's a further problem with the translation. Thank you, Mr. Falk.

Go ahead, Mr. Macklem.

3:45 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

Do you want me to back up at all?

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Just go back a sentence or two, if you could.

3:45 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

This shift is increasing the stimulative impact of our quantitative easing program per dollar purchased. By concentrating purchases at longer maturities, we can have a bigger impact on the interest rates that are most important for households and businesses. This is allowing us to reduce our total minimum weekly purchases to $4 billion while still providing as much monetary stimulus.

Our QE program will continue until the recovery is well under way.

I hope this provides a good explanation of the bank's outlook and the policy response.

We work for Canadians, and it's essential that we be accountable to them, and appearances like this one are an important part of that accountability. Beyond this, monetary policy works better when it's well understood. The pandemic and the extraordinary actions we are taking in response only make it more important that we speak clearly and listen attentively to Canadians.

We want to be very clear: Canadians can be confident that borrowing costs are going to remain very low for a long time. In this way, our forward guidance combined with the QE program reduce one source of uncertainty. These efforts will help support the spending and investment that the economy needs to restore the lost jobs and achieve our inflation target.

Finally, Chair, if I can take a minute, at the risk of embarrassing my colleague, to say a few words, as you did, to recognize our deputy governor, Carolyn Wilkins.

As you know, Ms. Wilkins has decided not to seek a second term, and she's going to be leaving us after our next monetary policy decision in December. Ms. Wilkins has spent her entire career working for the people of Canada, with the past 20 years at the Bank of Canada. As senior deputy governor, she's provided tremendous leadership as a policy-maker. In particular, her experience has been instrumental in helping design the bank's response to the pandemic. She has been a champion for research and diversity at the bank and has driven the work that will underpin the next renewal of our inflation-targeting agreement. Thanks to Ms. Wilkins, the bank has become a global thought leader in fintech and digital currencies. She has served Canada with distinction as the bank's representative at the G7 and the G20 and the Financial Stability Board.

On a more personal note, I can tell you that her deep understanding of the Canadian economy and her insights at the policy table are going to be very difficult to replace. Her commitment to Canadians, her intellectual leadership and her good judgment are second to none. On behalf of every Canadian, I want to thank her for her service and wish her every future success.

Thank you, Chair. With that, Senior Deputy Governor Wilkins and I would be very pleased to answer your questions.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Wayne Easter

Thank you very much, Mr. Governor. Those are words well deserved, and I can see Ms. Wilkins on my screen. She didn't even blush. If you were here, Ms. Wilkins, and these were normal times around the table, we'd give you a round of applause. To the Governor's remarks, these are certainly not normal times.

With that, we will go to the first round of six minutes. We'll have Ms. Jansen for the first three, followed by Mr. Falk for about three and then Mr. Fraser.

Ms. Jansen, the floor is yours.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

Thank you.

Mr. Macklem, you briefed us by saying “the Governing Council agreed that extraordinary monetary policy support will continue to be needed.” I'm wondering if I understand you correctly. Are you saying that you need to keep buying government debt, basically printing money, for Canada to remain solvent?

3:50 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

No, that's not what we're saying at all. What we're saying is that our inflation target is well below the target. The Canadian economy is weak. There are still more than 600,000 Canadians who've lost their jobs and haven't got them back. That's putting downward pressure on inflation. Against that background, we need a lot of monetary stimulus, extraordinary monetary stimulus, to support the recovery and get Canadians back to work and inflation back to target.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

What you're saying is that you would not have to continue that. We could remain solvent without it. Is that what you're saying?

3:50 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

That is what I'm saying. We are not financing the government. Our actions, by lowering interest rates and by buying government bonds, are lowering the cost of financing the government. In fact, they're lowering the cost of borrowing for everybody.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

I have one more question.

3:50 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

We're not financing the government.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

The level of aggressiveness the Bank of Canada takes on future economic distresses will be the most significant economic events of the next decade. Can you commit to stop purchasing government debt once the inflation rate reaches your 2% target, yes or no?

3:50 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

In fact, if you look at the guidance we have provided, we have committed to stop buying government bonds once the recovery is well under way.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

So is that at the 2% target?

3:50 p.m.

Governor, Bank of Canada

Tiff Macklem

That would probably happen before we actually get to the 2% target.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Tamara Jansen Conservative Cloverdale—Langley City, BC

Okay. I will cede my time now to my colleague. Thank you.