Evidence of meeting #13 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was fishery.
A recording is available from Parliament.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Fabian Manning
Thank you, Mr. Gaudry.
We'll open the floor for questions from Mr. MacAulay.
10:15 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Welcome. You've indicated that there are over 2,000 people involved in the fishery, and about three-quarters of them are first nations. Is that correct?
10:15 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
You mentioned something about rules that are going to be put in place. I'd like you to elaborate a little more on the rules and the rule problem you have, both federal and provincial. Not that we can do much about the provincial rules, but we'd like to have an overview of the problems with the new rules.
10:15 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
You mean the rules and regulations?
10:15 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
Yes. You indicated that there was a problem with rules that are being put in place. I'd just like you to elaborate on the rules and the problems you're having with the new rules.
10:15 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
Well, the regulations in Manitoba are under the management of the province. The federal government is not part of the management of the fishery. It's the province. So the rules and regulations come from the province.
The problem we have is the lack of communication and consultation with the stakeholders. Hopefully there are some changes coming. Hopefully there'll be what they call a resource management board. With that resource management board, hopefully, the province, the stakeholders, and the marketing side will all be on one committee and will come up with regulations for sustainable development of the fishery.
There are changes coming. We haven't seen them yet, but hopefully they'll be implemented in the next--
10:20 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
Do you have enough input into what's taking place, the rules that are being put in place?
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
Since we've been organizing in the last three years, we've finally seen some changes.
10:20 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
You indicated the watersheds and farmland drainage and the problem with fish kill. Those are problems in a lot of different places. I'd just like you to elaborate for the committee about what you think should be done in those situations. Where is the problem? What do you or your committee think should be done?
If I understood you correctly, you're telling the committee--you didn't say it, but I'm asking you--that the drainage of the farmland is causing some fish kill.
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
The draining of farmland is happening so quickly now. During the spring runoffs, the fish travel up those waterways. They're not natural drains; they're drains built by municipalities.
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
It is killing the fish. As these drains go up inland, they end up in these marshes. When the drainage stops, the fish get caught in those areas. When the fish get caught in those areas, there's no way of coming back to the lakes, because the water's run out.
The water's running so fast now. We need to gradually drain by putting in structures that'll slow the process so you'll at least have a drain that lasts four weeks. That will at least allow the fish to spawn and get their stock back into the lakes. The way these drains are built today they're very high-tech and fast-moving and they allow water to be moved in days. And this is causing a concern for us.
10:20 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
What should be put in place? Should a system be put in place that allows gradual drainage?
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
Yes, there should be some sort of structure that allows the flow to be slowed. You have to slow it down to a point where drainage is gradual, not fast-moving like the systems we see now. At that point, you will see a difference in the fish habitat and the stocks as they manage to spawn and manage to come back to the lakes.
Those are some of the issues that were brought to our attention. When you put rock formations in the bottom of the drains and build them up, that slows some of the water. I've seen them built in some of the rivers. They've done a tremendous job in slowing the velocity of the water, and that allows fish to migrate. With these fast-flowing drains, there's such a velocity of water coming through that some fish can't make it to the point where they want to spawn. So you have to slow down the drainage with the rock formations.
10:20 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
So on the new drains that you're recommending or some of the drains that you say are done properly, does that take some...? I'm just wondering. There would be fertilizers and ingredients coming out of the soil. If the proper drainage were put in place, would that be a way of stopping that from getting into the water? I expect you're telling me that this is killing the fish.
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
We're not saying it's the chemicals that are killing the fish. It's the fish being trapped, not making it back over. But if you have some kind of structure that slows the flow, as these chemicals are flowing through, it also meets the obstruction, and it stops there, and it helps the filtration. We need some kind of regulation to slow down the process of the fast-moving drainage systems that are being built without concern for the fishery. That's a big, huge concern for us.
10:20 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
You also mentioned emergencies, and I think you mentioned a dual problem: wharves or harbours in particular and then areas that you need for emergency situations. I'd like you to just elaborate, please.
10:20 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
It seems as though the wind storms today pick up in a matter of hours. You're out there fishing and all of a sudden you see the storm come over. They're more severe than we've seen in the past. Where do you head for shore? It's to harbours. We need harbours. Maybe there are other communities that could use them. There are challenges there to build new ones. The funding is a challenge. Harbours are also in need of repair, so there are all these challenges we face in our harbours--the maintenance, the upkeep, making sure they're still usable--and who comes with the dollars to do the repairs? Those are the questions. We have challenges in finding the funding to maintain these structures. There's a need for them. There are also the safety issues surrounding these storms.
10:25 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
I'd like you to elaborate on the dredging. Is there proper dredging? When you have a storm, that becomes a much bigger problem.
10:25 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
When you have a storm, you have higher volumes of water flowing, higher velocities coming through the drainage, coming through your river systems, heading through your lakes. That causes erosion. These storms cause erosion on the embankments, and then you have debris floating in the lakes and it gets caught in our equipment. It destroys our equipment.
So we have a lot of concerns when you have such a velocity of water coming in. The velocity of the water is so high to the extent that it is causing damage. We're looking at the industry that is predominantly the cause of this, and it is the agricultural industry. We look at them and say they're lobbying; they're working to have their land cleared and their land drained. But they're also having an effect on other industries. When will they be accountable and take some steps to fix the problem?
10:25 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
But you also indicated, I believe, if I heard you correctly, that this large flow of water causes problems even for some communities.
10:25 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
During the winter, the flows don't slow down. During the winter, all of a sudden you still have the high velocity of flows--
10:25 a.m.
Liberal
Lawrence MacAulay Liberal Cardigan, PE
What I'd like you to speak about is whether this could provide an ally for you, regarding the community problem you have. I'd like you to go that way.
10:25 a.m.
Interim Chair, Manitoba Commercial Inland Fishers Federation
That's where the community problems come up, because the frazil ice builds up, and when the frazil ice builds up and it plugs your river at the mouth of the lake, then your river backs up and floods your community and your roads. Then access to your communities is basically shut off. There have been some emergency situations where this has happened in the last few years in Manitoba.