Fisheries Committee on Nov. 26th, 2007

[Jackey Richard]

Each wharf is unique. A separate plan is prepared for each wharf, taking into account the climate and other factors that may have an impact on the long-term development of the wharf.

There's no one-size-fits-all type of approach.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Could we say that wharves may deteriorate more in some places? As a result, when the government or the department estimates that restoring wharves will call for $475 million, priority should be given to places where the infrastructures deteriorate more rapidly.

[Jackey Richard]

I can't really talk about how fast the infrastructure deteriorates in different regions. The infrastructure as a whole has deteriorated considerably. That is what has to be recognized. I can't know the details of why the infrastructure in a particular region deteriorates faster than in another. I don't have those figures at hand, and so I can't speak to the differences.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Has the department done studies to determine that in a particular place the life of a wharf is 15 years, and that in another it is 20 years or 26 years, and that based on the geography, more breakwaters should be installed, with this or that? Does the department do studies like this?

[Jackey Richard]

I am sure that studies have been done, but I am not the one who has requested them. If I am not mistaken, from 2001 to 2004 the infrastructure was reviewed, an asset-based review was done. Studies were done in each region. However, I can't say exactly what initiatives and what conclusions came out of them.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

How much time do I have left, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

You have one minute and 20 seconds.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

I would first like to address the subject of climate change. We should perhaps give Mr. Boland an opportunity to express himself on that question.

Ms. Richard, you undoubtedly have an opinion on the subject. I think that climate change, higher tides and storms are resulting in rapid deterioration of infrastructure and wharves. In fact there have recently been storms in the Maritimes at Christmas, over the holiday period.

Do you agree?

[Jackey Richard]

Absolutely. We have had three storms in the last four or five years: the one at Christmas, another one at Christmas two years ago in the Gulf region, and Hurricane Juan, a few years earlier. Those storms had a greater impact because of the serious state of disrepair of the infrastructure.

[Raynald Blais, Bloc, Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Boland, is the same thing happening where you are?

[James Boland]

I would agree. There is another consideration, though. Climate change is changing the impact on the fisheries, so the fishing vessels are changing. In some cases they're getting much larger, so we need more space for them to be housed at the harbour. As the resources change on climate change impacts, they're going after different types of species.

[The Chair, Conservative, Fabian Manning]

Thank you, Mr. Blais.

Mr. Stoffer.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our guests for coming today.

You both mentioned the aquaculture and commercial fishery use of the wharves, but you didn't mention the sports fishery. Mr. Boland, the sports fishery is a huge industry on the west coast but not so much on the east coast, although we do have some of it. What is the impact of the sports fishery on these wharves? Do you have a figure for that?

[James Boland]

I don't have an exact figure, but we do have strategies that the harbour authorities put in place. As the fishing fleet moves out for the summer and the recreational boat traffic comes in, they'll rent the same strip out. So they're getting double booking for the same slip to improve their revenue base.

They would like to have more recreational opportunities, but in most cases they're fixed with the space they have available. Their primary use is for the commercial fishery, but they do very creatively try to address the needs of the recreational fishery as well.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Are there no figures at all that are compiled as to what the use is by the sports fishery of the wharves in B.C., such as you have for aquaculture and commercial?

[James Boland]

I can get those for you. I don't have them with me today.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

That would be greatly appreciated.

Also, as you know, the situation at Digby has grown. The Digby situation in Nova Scotia was an ugly affair, but not necessarily with the small craft harbours, because Transport Canada was involved in this as well.

One of the issues back home is the grey area between where DFO and the small craft harbours program has responsibility and where Transport Canada has responsibility. It's always a bit of a confusing issue, especially when it comes to breakwater repair. I was up in the high Arctic, and they're very concerned about breakwater issues. But I know that's not for you to address.

In Nova Scotia, as you know, with the increasing stormy weather we're getting, the demand for breakwaters is increasing. Does breakwater repair or additions or deletions fall upon the small craft harbours program, or is it a Transport Canada responsibility?

[Jackey Richard]

The small craft harbours program does have breakwaters within its inventory. Therefore, if the breakwater is instrumental in protecting and providing shelter to our harbour, that is part of our long-term planning process, and we will be spending money, as priorities are determined, to repair and develop as needed.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Adding new ones would be your responsibility as well, is that right?

[Jackey Richard]

If it's within the harbour and it is deemed to be a requirement as part of the long-term plan for that harbour, yes.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

Who determines that, Madam? What role would Transport play in any of that?

[Jackey Richard]

Transport Canada does not play a role. They have breakwaters that they use for their own purposes, but when we determine the requirement for breakwaters within the harbour, that's determined by the engineers, in consultation oftentimes with the harbour authorities, with the community, and with Public Works and other experts in that area. And there are studies undertaken to understand what the requirement is, as well as the tidal action and the breakwater requirement for that harbour.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

This is my last question. Are there still some harbours you're going to divest yourself of? Is that list public, and if it is, is it possible to get a copy for our committee for the maritime region?

[Jackey Richard]

I'm not sure if it is a public list, but that's something I can bring to my Ottawa counterparts and ask them if we can make that information known.

[Peter Stoffer, NDP, Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS]

It would be helpful for the MPs of those areas that are affected. They could at least advise their community groups that this is coming down the pipe and they may wish to either participate in HAs or sort of defend their interest in keeping it a core project.