Fisheries Committee on June 9th, 2016

[Robert Morley]

In terms of processing plants in British Columbia, as indicated, we could go back and say there should be a plant in every community, whether it's a local first nations community or somewhere else. In 1919, there were 97 canneries in B.C. They employed 9,000 workers. Most of those were first nations people. You heard some of that history the other day.

I would contend that if we had an adjacency principle that required the delivery of fish to those plants in all those communities for processing there, we would not have a commercial salmon fishery in B.C. today. No one could afford to go fishing and deliver to those plants. Those plants could not afford to meet the rigorous inspection standards required in the international standards of buyers. It is not economical to operate a seasonal operation in every little community up and down the coast.

What you are seeing, in order to compete on world markets, is that fish plants are trying to become more multi-species and work year-round. If you look at a number of the plants that are operating, both on Vancouver Island in certain locations and in the Lower Mainland, you will see that they are operating on multi-species multi-fisheries and employing workers year-round. In some of the more remote locations, where you only have access to seasonal fisheries and little quantities, it isn't going to work economically, unless the government wants to subsidize a plant in every community. That's the only way they're going to operate.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you, Mr. Finnigan.

[Pat Finnigan, Liberal, Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

We'll go to Mr. Zimmer for five minutes.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you for the nice warm welcome.

I'm from British Columbia, like a few of my colleagues around the table. I have a question for Robert.

We often hear arguments.... LNG is a big deal in my riding, etc., and we often hear that one group wants to support 100% of something, and they end up getting nothing, because the industry can't survive. If fleet separation comes to B.C., what's the fallout for the fishing industry in B.C.?

[Robert Morley]

I'm not sure exactly how it would be implemented. Are you suggesting that the government is going to say that we have to sell our licences? You're going to force us to get rid of our licences?

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Not me. I'm not government. I'm the opposition.

[Robert Morley]

I find it hard to answer that question, really, because I can't conceive that the government would require companies that have provided good jobs and good income to fishermen and have lived by the rules.... That you would come along and say, “I'm going to take away the large part of your assets of your business”, so that we basically don't have a business anymore, I just can't conceive of that happening.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Just to be clear, I'm in the opposition. I'm a Conservative on the Conservative side, so that's why I'm asking you.

[Robert Morley]

I know.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Again, if this process is to proceed and is possibly something that the government desires to do, my concern is the fallout from that. You have a good industry that has been established for many years and is one that works.

I guess you've basically answered my question about what the fallout of that is, because I see good companies that employ a lot of Canadians, a lot of British Columbians, and if we now somehow put this dramatic change for the industry on the table, can it survive? That's my comment: 70% of something is much better than 100% of nothing.

I have another question for you. How much of the fish caught on the west coast—and this is a broad question to answer, maybe, in your company terms—is actually processed in B.C.?

[Robert Morley]

How much of it is processed where?

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

In B.C.

[Robert Morley]

For our company, 100% of the fish we land in British Columbia is processed in British Columbia.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Right.

[Robert Morley]

I would say that's true for most of the companies in B.C. It's a very small part that is exported somewhere else for processing.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

Knowing that, Christine, I think you mentioned the higher costs of the fish, etc. Ultimately, the customer is the person who has to pay for the fish and has to decide whether they are going to choose one cut over the other. If they're at a particular retailer, they're going to pick the cheaper one. If they need to buy food for their families, they're going to choose one because it's $5 a fillet, or whatever the cost is, over the one that's $10. I see the competitive need in the industry, I guess, to do what it does.

I would ask Robert again, I guess, if this is implemented.... Let's use your company. Have you thought of a worst-case scenario? What would happen if the government decided to do this tomorrow? What would happen to the company?

[Robert Morley]

I can't really answer that question. I don't see it happening. I don't see the need for it. I don't see that there's any evidence that the current system is not working properly.

Our company is in the business of trying to make money for our investor. We would readjust our business, but it would mean that there really would be less business to be done in B.C., I think. That's the answer.

[Bob Zimmer, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River—Northern Rockies, BC]

That's all I have.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Scott Simms]

Thank you, Mr. Zimmer.

We'll go back to the government side for five minutes.

Mr. Morrissey, go ahead, please.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

I have one question. I believe it would be for Mr. Morley.

You made a comment about the per unit labour cost for Alaska versus B.C. What's the difference per unit in the processing of salmon? Do you know?

[Robert Morley]

Yes. For example, on a cost-per-case basis for a case of salmon, the labour cost in Alaska is about one-third of what it is in B.C.

B.C. is a very high-cost place to live. We pay our shoreworkers very good wages, and we're happy to do that, but the difficulty is that in Alaska, our competitors can get people to work there—and we can as well—and they're happy to work for a lot less, partly because they're working for a very short season and they get a lot of overtime. That's the way the industry has evolved there.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

This question is for Ms. Burridge.

How have the incomes for fishers changed over the years? I would gather from the testimony that's been given that the impact on the plant has been driven to a large extent by a changing marketplace, which is demanding a product other than canned salmon. What impact has that had on the incomes of fishers over the past number of years?

[Christina Burridge]

I think it depends very much on which period of time you take.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

I've looked back at the last five to ten years, specifically as that has related to salmon.