Fisheries Committee on June 3rd, 2020

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

In the COVID-19 era, how has foreign ownership of licences, quotas and processing impacted fisheries' operations in the Pacific?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

I'm not aware of any impacts regarding the foreign ownership in the Pacific.

Sylvie, do you have any other knowledge of any possible impacts that might have happened?

[Sylvie Lapointe]

I've certainly not heard from any of the industries on the west coast that this has happened.

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

The concern is that we know you don't track foreign ownership on the west coast.

Has the government looked at ensuring that there's a fair split for those who are leasing quota, like a fifty-fifty split? We know people have committed to leasing prices based on last year's market price. Before they even untie their boats and leave the dock they're going bankrupt.

Is this something that you're looking at intervening in while you're responding to the sharing of risks and benefits and to how you're going to, hopefully, implement that plan that was put forward by this committee?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

The department is starting to look at the issue of foreign ownership, as a result of the considerations of this committee.

The Department of Fisheries and Oceans has no position on foreign ownership, as we can see by the difference in treatment of foreign ownership in the Pacific and the two different ways we treat foreign ownership in the various Atlantic fleets. We have decided to undertake some research on the issue of foreign ownership and beneficial ownership of fishing licences in Canada, as a result of—

[Gord Johns, NDP, Courtenay—Alberni, BC]

During COVID-19, we're seeing the impact of that. It's serious to those fishers. It's harming those fishers and those communities.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Johns. Your time is up.

We'll now go to the second round of questions.

We'll start with Mr. Bragdon, for five minutes or less, please.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My first question is for Mr. Forgeron.

Does the DFO's strategic policy see the necessity of government support to increase the availability of Canadian fish and seafood to Canadians and to build demand in our domestic markets? Is there any strategy under way for that?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

Industry stakeholders have raised the need to target the domestic market a little more than has been done in the past. As you would all be aware as members of this committee, we're a very export-oriented industry. Our provincial colleagues have also raised this.

We are discussing the possibility of whether we want to collectively launch, in partnership with our provincial counterparts and the industry, something more in the domestic area of marketing, as opposed to our traditional export marketing efforts.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

I have another question along the same line.

Does DFO's strategic policy see the necessity for governments to reconnect our fish and seafood exports with overseas markets as a result of what's been happening? Have there been efforts and outreach to those areas, along with the domestic market? Also, has the need for expanding those efforts in domestic and foreign markets been communicated to the minister?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

The department hasn't undertaken any new expanded marketing efforts during this period of time. What we have been seeing is an increase in market demand slowly returning as things become normalized. We're now seeing that a bit in the Asian markets, which of course were the first markets hit by COVID. We haven't determined whether we need any long-term plans to target those markets, beyond letting them recover at this point in time.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

In regard to the EI changes that are in the works, which perhaps need to be looked at, when can self-employed fish harvesters and share persons expect to receive the details of the EI changes that the government said it would be proposing? Will the EI changes be proposed in legislation?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

I do not know the answers to those questions, because that falls under the work of my colleagues at ESDC. However, these are questions we're receiving from both the industry and our provincial counterparts, even most recently as this morning, from the provinces.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Yes, it's pretty relevant.

Is there something DFO is doing to ensure that whatever proposed changes are coming through EI will actually fit the needs of the fishers? Is there collaboration and communication going on with our front-line harvesters?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

The harvesters' representatives are discussing with us and asking us questions about EI and the other programs. We are currently focused on our current DFO programs, which are going to be delivered by either the regional agencies or ESDC, to ensure that they're understandable enough for our harvester community to apply in an easy, quick way. For instance, in the case of the fish harvester grants and benefits, we have asked ESDC to have call centre capacity to help our harvester community understand the system when applying for this stuff. One of the principles we had in setting up the program was to keep it as simple as possible, for accessibility purposes.

[Richard Bragdon, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

My next question will be along the same lines as the fish harvester benefits.

As I'm sure you realize, some people are probably falling through the cracks, and there are some unique situations that pertain to fishers and harvesters. Are measures being taken by DFO to address areas where some people may be falling through the cracks of the Canada emergency wage subsidy program? In certain situations, some of the harvesters and fishers, like others, maybe don't fit into a certain category and there will have to be some tweaking or adjustments. Are you aware of any of that taking place right now?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

We don't have any responsibility directly for the Canada emergency wage subsidy. The fish harvester benefit program was a direct response to the fact that we realized our owner-operators and our share persons, who collectively made up the majority of the fishing fleets' crews, were completely falling between the stools, if you will, of eligibility. That was a direct response to that.

The government has made adjustments over time on the wage subsidy program, including the period of time. What we heard was a large issue here in the fish harvesting community was that it simply did not match their seasons, though it has now been extended. We do pass the advocacy efforts of our stakeholders on to our interdepartmental colleagues, to ensure that those are a part of their policy deliberations and discussions, though we have no responsibility for those programs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Forgeron and Mr. Bragdon.

We'll now move to Mr. Hardie for five minutes or less, please.

[Ken Hardie, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses, who've toughed it out with us today.

I wanted to talk a little bit, not about the economic health of our fishers but about their physical health. There's a news report out of Alaska that a fish boat arrived in port with 86 crew members testing positive for COVID-19. What do we know about the safety protocols in place for the people who are out on the boats?

[Jean-Guy Forgeron]

Occupational health and safety issues in our fishing fleet are actually within provincial jurisdiction, not federal jurisdiction. The Department of Fisheries and Oceans has not been involved in that. The different provincial jurisdictions have worked with their harvesting community and with their health organizations to establish guidelines in that regard for their fishing fleets. Our current grant program, for instance, the fish harvester benefit, would allow for them to have some liquidity in order to implement elements of that plan if they needed liquidity for that. In terms of direct guidelines, guidance and regulations of occupational health and safety vis-à-vis COVID-19 in the fishing fleet, that falls under provincial jurisdiction, with provincial authorities working with labour and their appropriate associations.

[Ken Hardie, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

You can understand that it's pretty close quarters, obviously, on some of these vessels. With respect to that, what would happen if you got a signal from a vessel out at sea that a crew member had come down with COVID and is really very gravely ill? Is this something the Coast Guard is in a position to respond to with the appropriate safety measures in place?

[Chris Henderson]

Thank you for that question.

The Coast Guard certainly is involved in responding to reports of mariners who have COVID-like symptoms. It hasn't happened yet, as far as I'm aware, in the fishing context, although it has happened in the commercial shipping context. What happens is that our marine communications and traffic services maintain radio communication with the shipmaster. We go through a screening procedure with them that is based on the Public Health Agency of Canada guidelines. We pass on that information to the Public Health Agency. They consult, and working with Transport Canada, they will hold that ship either at anchor or offshore until we get an answer as to whether or not we need to be concerned about COVID.

As happened in one case on the east coast where a ship was actually in harbour, we liaise with the provincial health authorities to make sure any crew member is looked after appropriately. Our own crew are trained in dealing with mariners who might have COVID. They have the proper personal protective equipment, procedures and training to be able to deal with a mariner displaying COVID, but as I mentioned, nothing that I'm aware of has occurred so far in the fishing fleet.

[Ken Hardie, Liberal, Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC]

Have we had any instances where a fishing vessel has shown up in a small community, basically unannounced, with a sick crew member on board and that sick person presents a challenge for that local community to deal with?

[Chris Henderson]

No, sir, not that I'm aware of.

On the west coast, in the lead-up to the May long weekend, we were particularly concerned about the fine weather encouraging people to take to the water for recreational purposes, and that also included significant concern about seasonal travellers from the United States who tend to take that waterway up toward Alaska for the summer.

As you can imagine, there are some very small communities, mostly indigenous communities, along that route. These are great places that traditionally people stop by, so we were working hard to discourage people from making that trip, working with the Canada Border Services Agency, the U.S. Coast Guard and the RCMP. We put out a lot of communication about that and about the border closure, which was—up until then, by and large—a land border and an airport border. How can I put this...? We basically moved it out onto the water to make sure that we were also making sure that people knew the border on the water was closed as well.

With direct regard to your question, I'm not familiar with that scenario you described.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Hardie. Your time is up.

We'll now go to Mr. Fast for five minutes or less, please.