Fisheries Committee on March 19th, 2024

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Townsend.

Ms. Carey, you spoke about the traceability system that you felt should be implemented and how you looked for an outside organization that could implement this, but then you were told it could only be used for personal use and it couldn't be expanded beyond that. Please correct me if any of that is incorrect. Based on what you said, that's what I heard.

I'm wondering if you can share a bit more, because we did quite an in-depth study on the traceability of seafood, and I think this is a really important component of the work we're doing today.

Can you share a bit—because I only have a few seconds left—about what this traceability system might look like? What do you think are the key features of this traceability system?

[Genna Carey]

It would start where our paper system is leaving off, which is tracking each river, the estimated quota leaving each river, and then final tallies at our facilities once you've done a final weight. However, this would be put into real time, likely digitally through an app with time-stamps and specific to each individual harvester versus a team filling out a logbook. This then allows it to be traced to each person versus each team or each truck. Those numbers are then, obviously, tracked from the riverbank to the facility, and from the facility at each sale, following it, of course, straight out of the country.

Depending on the company I was chatting with, there were a few different avenues of getting there. The one Canadian company I spoke with.... Because time was short, things were going to be pilot projects, so probably not the exact system we're going to use forever, but something to get the job done for this season. It would use, say, batch numbers or a tracing number that would then follow each elver shipment out of the country.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Ms. Barron.

We'll now go to Mr. Arnold for five minutes or less, please.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for being here. Your personal situation with this especially creates.... It's really something that all parliamentarians need to hear.

Ms. Carey, you were speaking about the traceability system. I'm glad to hear that you spoke about it being real-time and digital and so on. I don't want to diminish in any way the work you are doing, but I'm familiar with the west coast, where it was required to have a printed sheet of paper to record the chinook salmon that one caught. There was a maximum of 10 per year, per fisherman, but all a fisherman needed to do was simply print another piece of paper. Therefore, I'm glad to hear that your system is going digital. They finally accepted a digital program that someone else had to basically develop for the DFO, but it took years for them to get that accepted and approved.

Earlier witnesses were talking about the need for a proper regulatory regime, and there was discussion about the difficulty in differentiating imported elvers that came into Canada from elvers that were actually caught here, that were domestically caught. Would the traceability system allow for the difference between imported and domestically caught elvers?

[Genna Carey]

I would just like to highlight to you that our original traceability system was developed by the industry. I sat at the table and developed that logbook in triplicate, so you can't just print a new piece of paper. Therefore, it only makes sense that I got to sit at the table to develop the digital system.

Yes, I do think that the digital system would help with that, because those eels would be traced. There would be five kilograms associated with this tag number, and its movements would be tracked throughout its range in our country and on export.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you.

Mr. King, have you been sending in reports of elver poaching this year to various enforcement agencies?

[Stanley King]

Yes, sir. We put out our trail cameras two days ago, and instantly we got pictures of people poaching elvers. There are still more to come out. For the two days we've had them out, both days I've sent emails to a long list of people to report that.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Has there been any response from enforcement agencies on that?

[Stanley King]

The first day I got a one-word email back that said “Received”.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Is that all?

[Stanley King]

That's it so far, yes, but that's more than I got last year out of 30.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you.

I'm going to take a little bit of my time here to move a motion that was put on notice last week. I apologize to the witnesses, because what we're hearing from you is very important, but you are commercial fishermen.

The motion reads:

That, given that the carbon tax is increasing the cost of inputs for commercial fish harvesters, and that the government has committed to hiking the carbon tax on April 1st, the committee report to the House its recommendation to spike the hike, and axe the tax.

I move that motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Is there any discussion?

Mr. Morrissey.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Mr. Chair, first of all, I have a brief comment on the motion. I respect my colleague and, quite frankly, will state on the record that this has come from the centre, from his leader's office. I don't think it has come from the member, because of the inaccuracy of the motion put forward regarding the inputs to commercial fishers. This is a propaganda piece the Conservative Party has been putting forward for a year now.

Let me repeat that diesel fuel used by commercial fishers is exempt from the carbon price, as is gasoline. How, then, do you justify the comment you made on the inputs?

I'm very close to the commercial fishery. In terms of the input costs, the highest one is wages, which is not subject to tax. Bait is not subject to tax. Fuel is not subject to tax. Interest on a loan is not subject to tax. Where, then, is carbon pricing impacting the inputs to commercial fisheries? The premise of your motion is totally erroneous, because it doesn't exist.

However, I'll tell you one thing that does exist and that I see. I live in Atlantic Canada. I don't know about the west coast. I see the real impact of climate change that is affecting an industry that has been very beneficial to Atlantic Canadians. Like my colleague, I am the son of fishers. We were the poorest people when I grew up in our community. That's not the case today, because of a very well-managed fishery.

However, something that should concern every Atlantic Canadian is the impact of climate change on these lucrative fisheries. This is something on which the Conservative Party chooses to stick its head in the sand and ignore, using motions like this that are totally erroneous. When I look at all the principal inputs to the commercial fishery, carbon pricing does not affect them.

Let's take your motion to a more global extent, on shipping, because, again, it's moving product. Shipping rates and trucking rates today are equal to two years ago.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I have a point of order.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Mr. Chair, I'm speaking to the motion that was put forward.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I haven't even gotten to say what my point of order is.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

That's fair.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

If MP Morrissey is going to speak for the next 10 or 15 minutes, I'm just wondering if we want to dismiss the witnesses. I would prefer we get back to questioning the witnesses.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Mr. Chair, with all due respect to the point of order—

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I'm just asking.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Hold on.

On that point of order, there was a motion moved on the floor by Mr. Arnold.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

There's no regard for the time left for the witnesses, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Exactly.

Also, Mr. Morrissey asked to respond to that motion, and that's exactly what he's doing.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Why did your colleague move a motion that was frivolous at this point in time?