Fisheries Committee on May 9th, 2024

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Greetings to our witnesses.

Madam Minister, it's a pleasure to welcome you to the committee today.

I, too, have tried redfish. It's a really delicious fish. You know, it swims up not too far from my region, in Rimouski. So we have the opportunity to taste it and process it, and this fishery is excellent news.

My question today concerns the allocation of the redfish quota. DFO allocates a quota of 25,000 tonnes, of which 58.69% goes to offshore vessels, according to the quota breakdown. As you know, offshore vessels are over 100 feet long.

I'd like you to confirm how many offshore vessel owners reside in the riding of Gaspésie—Les Îles‑de‑la‑Madeleine.

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

I'd like to remind you that the quota of 25,000 tonnes we've set is a starting point. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, meetings have been held with the redfish advisory committee. I recently received a report and decisions will be made shortly. When we announced the reopening of the fishery, I committed to following the advisory committee's recommendations.

A 10% allocation will go to inshore fishermen, as well as to indigenous communities. The advisory committee also made recommendations in response to concerns about bycatch, other species caught in the redfish fishery. We're really working on that, and we're also discussing how the quotas were allocated.

Following our consultations, the provinces asked us to respect historical quotas, which we did.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

I want to understand your personal opinion. You know coastal communities well. You've been the Member for Gaspésie—Les Îles‑de‑la‑Madeleine since 2015.

As you know, 60% of the redfish quota goes to offshore vessels, the same vessels that were banned in recent years during the redfish moratorium. We can count on the fingers of one hand the number of owners of offshore boats in the Gaspé and Magdalen Islands. This means that the lion's share of the quota is going to big companies, instead of helping small-scale fishermen who really need it and who are subject to restrictions in other fisheries, such as the shrimp fishery.

I'd like to know if you agree with helping big companies more instead of helping those who make their living from fishing and who really need support.

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

In Quebec, we don't have any big companies, as you said. I can assure you that the Magdalen Islands have no intention of building new boats, and that they're ready to work with indigenous communities and the people of Gaspé so that Quebec can catch its quota of redfish.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Fishermen are telling us that the historical quotas are no longer relevant. Just because it was good 25 years ago doesn't mean it's good today. Right now, you're helping the big companies instead of the communities that really need it.

What studies led you to make that decision, which in my opinion makes no sense in terms of distribution?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

The consultations that took place throughout Atlantic Canada and Quebec are not outdated consultations, because they took place last year. The Quebec government and the people of Quebec asked that the historic redfish quotas be maintained, and that's exactly what has happened. The fishing boats are putting people to work in plants in their region. It's important to try to get things right, in addition to the recommendations that will be made by the redfish advisory committee.

What I'm hearing on the ground and what the various associations I work with are telling me is that, for once, there's a minister who wants to work with the fishing industry and listens to fishermen. We can continue to work with our people.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

I appreciate you being so open, but I'm quoting the fishers. They say that there are very few offshore vessels greater than 100 feet in the Gulf of St. Lawrence. In fact, there are none at the moment. However, you allowed these offshore vessels to come back, even though they depleted the resource in the past.

That's what the fishers are saying. They don't understand that the mistakes of the past are being made again. They're afraid that the offshore vessels will deplete the redfish resource in a few years. Have you done any studies to confirm that's not going to happen?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

It's a quota fishery: As soon as the quota is reached, fishing stops.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Do you have any evidence that people are monitoring the quotas?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

That's one of the Redfish Advisory Committee's recommendations. I can assure you that we will follow the recommendations.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Do you also have data on bycatch?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Blanchette-Joncas.

You're a couple of seconds over the six-minute allotment.

We'll now go to Ms. Barron for six minutes, please.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for being here, and thank you to the other witnesses as well.

Minister, just yesterday, which was perfect timing, I met with representatives from Ecotrust, Coastal First Nations and UFAWU to talk about the necessary work towards a B.C. owner-operator licensing system.

As you know, our committee has completed two in-depth studies—one prior to my time and one during my time—that were unanimously recommending the implementation of a made-in-B.C. owner-operator licensing regime.

We also know that there is broad support in first nations, industry and communities for this change. We even saw the premier of my home province, Premier Eby, write a letter to the Prime Minister, and included you, urging the Government of Canada to work with the Province of British Columbia to develop a made-in-B.C. owner-operator licensing policy.

Minister, we know what needs to be done.

When will you direct the department to end the delays and begin working with first nations, industry and the province to implement this long-overdue policy reform?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

I was in British Columbia in December, and I also met with some owner-operators. The consultations therefore began in British Columbia.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

It's great that conversations are being had. A wealth of work has already been done in this area; witnesses came in for the study we did recently, and there are recommendations from the 2019 report. There's endless testimony and information that shows the direction forward. It seems as though there's a bit of a delay tactic happening here. Perhaps you can clarify. We know what needs to be done. We don't need to be asking the basic questions anymore. We need to be moving forward with actions. When will those actions be taken?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

I certainly don't think we should start from scratch. We have to take into account the work the committee has done, as well as the work being done in the consultations to promote owner-operators and keep moving forward.

Perhaps Ms. Gibbons would like to add something.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Minister, perhaps I could continue with my questions, and if Ms. Gibbons would like to follow up with some written information, that would be helpful.

This will be my last question in this section, Minister. I'm wondering if you're waiting for permission from the corporations and from foreign owners who now control the licences before you move forward with this desperately needed change.

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Waiting for corporate support isn't my way of doing business at all. What's important to me is that we get it right and work with the community so that the process goes smoothly in the future.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

I do appreciate your diligence in making sure you're getting it right. We know what needs to happen. What I'm asking today, Minister, on behalf of so many who are relying on this change to be made for the B.C. fisheries in order to ensure that there are fisheries for generations to come, is that you move forward with the actions necessary and use the recommendations that have already been provided to do the work that's necessary.

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

I really want to reassure you. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, my goal is to ensure that my children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren have access to resources and that we sustain the fisheries properly. That's why it's important to work with people in the industry and to see what we can do to be the architects of the fisheries of the future.

That's also why it's important to depoliticize the fishery, because all of us around this table are affected by its future. I'm having these discussions with fishers and their associations on the east and west coasts.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Minister. I was going to move on to my next set of questions, but I have just one last question around that. We know there are very different policies in place on the Atlantic coast. Why is it good enough for us to move forward with policies that are putting the owners and local fishers at the forefront on the east coast but not on the west coast?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

As I was saying, we have to work with people on the east and west coasts at the same time. Indigenous communities on the east coast will soon be travelling to the west coast to see how the fisheries there work and how they do aquaculture in particular. Fishers and their associations really want to be part of future solutions. I was talking about the importance of being the architects of the fishery of the future, and fishers and their associations want to be part of that. As we've always said, when we act alone, things definitely move quickly, but we create irritants. For me, it's important to work with everyone to make the fisheries sector sustainable.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you.

We'll now go to Mr. Arnold for five minutes, please.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister and department officials, for being here today.

Minister, in your last appearance, you mentioned a meeting with the ambassador of France and discussing a conference in Nice, France, in 2025.

Do you recall that?

[Diane Lebouthillier, Liberal, Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC]

Yes.