Fisheries Committee on Oct. 9th, 2024

[Yvonne Jones, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

First of all, let me clarify that the NAFO agreement has been in place since 1996. It was negotiated, at that time, at 5%, and it remains that way today. Minister Byrne was an MP for nearly 20 years of that time. That has been the case since 1996. It's not that NAFO pressured the government; it's not this big story that seems to be trending at the table. That's the information.

The other thing I want to outline here is that I'm sensing no support for the offshore licences in Newfoundland and in Labrador that gained access. That very much upsets me, because this is both professional and personal for me. Without that codfish allocation in Labrador, my plants go empty and my people's boats go empty, and that is not fair access. It's adjacent to their shores.

However, let me say this. We have three letters on record from the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador, stating that they would propose, if we're going to open it up to NAFO—which they know we have to; the agreement has been there for 30 years—that we also open it up to the offshore.

The first sign from the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador that it would not go to an offshore fishery came when Minister Byrne came into play. I have the letters here.

Mr. Small indicated, as well, that we should increase the northern cod allocation from 12,000 tonnes to a minimum of 25,000 tonnes. Maybe he doesn't remember that. Maybe Steve Kent wrote those letters for him as the bagman for the Conservative Party, when he had him on one of those two contracts that he paid him for in Newfoundland and Labrador, but the facts are the facts.

Stephen Harper cut the Fisheries Council of Canada. He cut the science in DFO. He got rid of all the scientists. It wasn't important in the fishing industry in Newfoundland and Labrador.

My memory is long. That is what I want to say to the member opposite and to the minister.

What we did in Newfoundland and Labrador this year was good news. It was good news to open a commercial cod fishery after 30 years, to let boats on the water and to let fish be landed in plants.

Let me tell you that the offshore licences that granted access to cod are landing cod in Arnold's Cove in Newfoundland. It is being processed in that plant. The boats are owned by Newfoundlanders.

Can you confirm that, Minister? They're fished by Newfoundlanders. The quota is landed in Arnold's Cove. It is processed by Newfoundlanders.

I would have to ask Minister Byrne and the head of the union why they would not support Newfoundland boats with Newfoundland crews landing fish in Newfoundland plants being processed by Newfoundlanders, when you allowed for them to sell product outside of Newfoundland and Labrador this year to other provinces and other plants. That is an irony I do not understand. Both the union and the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador push for fish to be sold outside of our province but will not accept their own people fishing the resource, landing it in their own plants and employing their own people, and they are against this 6%.

Let me tell you why they're against it. It is because until the fishermen went out in the street and thought that maybe we should have done better here—that 6% should have gone to the inshore or that 5% should have gone to the inshore—none of these people had any issues with it. They were writing letters pressuring the minister to do just that.

I want to put it on the record, and I want to ask both Minister Byrne and Ms. Street why they would not support offshore cod being landed and processed in Arnold's Cove, giving people there more weeks of work this year than they had in previous years.

[Gerry Byrne]

Thank you.

I'll lead the answer and leave it to the president-elect, Ms. Street, to follow, if that's okay.

I have to report to the committee that there was an interesting news story done on the fisheries broadcast by Paula Gale. I'll send the transcript through you, Mr. Chair, for distribution.

Ocean Choice International is an enterprise allocation holder for northern cod. The president of Ocean Choice International says publicly that he supports the 115,000-tonne backstop.

There is an appearance that the government has offered something that was not really wanted. Now, I'll let committee members decide for themselves what exactly that transcript says, but that is what was recorded.

The second thing I will say is that the Labrador Shrimp Company is one of the most excellent companies I've ever encountered in terms of quality product and treating their people well. With that said—

[Yvonne Jones, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Why, then, would you not want them to have access to the resource?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Ms. Jones....

[Gerry Byrne]

—I often recognize that the—

[Yvonne Jones, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

I want to pick up and ask a question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

You're out of time to ask a question.

[Gerry Byrne]

—Labrador Fishermen's Union Shrimp Company lands its fish in Port Hawkesbury.

Thank you for the protection, Mr. Chair, as we say.

I often remark that intra-fishers are the heart and soul of the Labrador Fishermen's Union Shrimp Company. Occasionally the Labrador Fishermen's Union Shrimp Company land their shrimp in Port Hawkesbury, Nova Scotia.

There are choices to be made, but we as public stewards have choices that we have to make as well.

[Yvonne Jones, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

I want to clarify that the shrimp landed by the shrimp company in Port Hawkesbury is market-ready. It's processed on board.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

The MP's time is up by over a minute.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

The time is up. Anything you haven't said in an answer, again, you can submit in writing, please.

[Gerry Byrne]

Sure. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

I want to get to Mr. Arnold for five minutes or less, please, before we finish up.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to go back to Mr. Byrne for a few minutes.

Minister, can you tell us why the CCFAM meeting went so poorly that it wasn't even able to produce a joint communiqué?

You touched on that briefly, but it sounds like trust has been lost in not just the department but in the minister's and Prime Minister's decisions on fisheries management. We've gone through five ministers. We're now on number six embroiled in this turmoil over the northern cod fishery, and her decision has gone counter to her boss's decision, the Prime Minister's decision.

We have fisheries and aquaculture ministers from across the country who have spoken out about the displeasure they sensed around that meeting.

Can you tell us why it went so poorly?

[Gerry Byrne]

We always live in hope that the moments that we experience can be turned around and things could get better.

That was a very, very difficult meeting for all participants. I think it turned out to be a very difficult meeting for the federal minister in the end.

I know that Nova Scotia's Minister Kent Smith expressed frustration because he wanted to talk about illegal and unreported catch, which was not put on the agenda. I wanted to talk about many things, including gulf redfish, gulf shrimp, northern cod and some other matters, but I really also wanted to talk about the solutions to all of the above, which was joint management. That was not allowed to be on the agenda.

It was the first time ever that a federal minister had acted on a unilateral basis to decide the agenda. We are a group of equals, the 14 of us. That's the way the structure of the Canadian Council for Fisheries and Aquaculture Ministers has always worked. We're a group of equals. That day, we were not. The federal minister had the final say.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Thank you, Minister.

I want to move on now to Dr. Carruthers.

You spoke about lessons learned and lessons forgotten in your opening remarks.

I'm going to quote another couple of recommendations from this committee's 2017 report, a unanimous report, as Mr. Byrne identified. This committee has worked and produced so many unanimous reports over the years with all parties in agreement.

Recommendation 8 was:

That Fisheries and Oceans Canada immediately create a rebuilding plan for the northern cod stock

Then, it goes through five bullet points on what should be done.

Recommendation 9 was:

That Fisheries and Oceans Canada implement management practices that deliver the greatest value from the resource with the lowest impact on stocks.

Ms. Carruthers, would you say that this government has followed through on the unanimous recommendations from this committee?

[Dr. Erin Carruthers]

No.

One of the things that I think are being lost in this discussion is that fishing on pre-spawning winter aggregations and spawning aggregations is a high-risk activity. It assumes that you have more than one spawning aggregation that recovers. It assumes that you have your stock assessment correct. It's just a much higher-risk situation, because the sexually mature fish are all packed together, and one of the pieces that has been missed today is talking about what a high-risk way of fishing that is.

To answer your question bluntly, no.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Okay. Briefly, is the new commercial fishery that was announced this year affecting those winter and spawning stocks? Is it extending into those seasons?

[Dr. Erin Carruthers]

I just saw that the season is to extend, I believe, until April 15 of next year, so the answer is yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Arnold. There are five seconds left.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

I'm so generous with my time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

You are. Thank you.

We'll now go to Ms. Thompson for five minutes or less, please.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

Thank you.

Mr. Byrne, if I could ask you quickly, are you familiar with the consulting firm The Focus Group?

[Gerry Byrne]

No, I'm not.

[Joanne Thompson, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

That's interesting. It is a firm owned by a former Conservative member from Newfoundland and Labrador, and this person, Steve Kent, is currently employed by the Conservative Party of Canada.

What I find interesting, Mr. Chair, is that our colleague, Mr. Small, has made 12 payments, for a total of $16,800, to this gentleman from his House of Commons budget—