Evidence of meeting #133 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was funding.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Annette Gibbons  Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Mario Pelletier  Commissioner, Canadian Coast Guard
Adam Burns  Assistant Deputy Minister, Programs Sector, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Niall O'Dea  Senior Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Geneviève Dubois-Richard

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

In my meetings with various associations and people in the industry, I hear about the need to invest in small craft harbours. We experienced hurricane Fiona and we'll be experiencing other major storms. The impact of climate change is being felt in the gulf. All the fishing associations are worried. People want to work together.

We did this in New Brunswick. We set up a pilot project for striped bass with the Maritime Fishermen's Union. The fishers also want to work with Fisheries and Oceans Canada to keep track of harvests. That way, we'll have data and we'll stop putting dead fish back into the water to feed the seals. We can use our resources for other purposes. The case of New Brunswick is a fine example. It just goes to show how much we can work together.

In terms of the Bloc Québécois, we know that its leader once said that squid fishing would save Quebec's fisheries, even though Quebec has hardly any squid.

Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB

Thank you, Minister.

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

Thank you, Mr. Cormier.

I will remind members not to talk over one another when other people are in a conversation, whether it's the minister answering a question or somebody else. The interpretation team has a hard time picking up whose voice they should be interpreting. That's especially for Mr. Perkins. He's been chirping all evening, but I'm going to forgive him for that for now.

Madame Desbiens, the next two and a half minutes are yours.

Caroline Desbiens Bloc Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Now my friend Mr. Cormier is angry with me.

I would like to set the record straight. We voted in favour of the appropriations. We didn't vote for the budget, because the budget tabled by the government was riddled with items that encroached on provincial and Quebec jurisdictions. That's why we aren't voting for the budget. As my leader said, it's easy to throw a few goodies into the proposals to try to get us to take the bait. However, it will take more than this given how clever we are in the Bloc Québécois.

By the way, I see that we had a ripple effect that prompted you to respond. You said that you wanted to take a closer look at bycatch to ensure that fish aren't put back in the water. You want us to work with fishers on the ground and take their measurements. This is great news. We've been lobbying the government on this issue for months, if not years. We've long known that it was the right thing to do. We're glad that you heard us.

That said, I'll be continuing along the same lines, or fishing lines, if you'll pardon the pun.

New scientific studies, which I must emphasize were carried out independently, propose a number of excellent solutions for involving people on the ground in decision‑making at Fisheries and Oceans Canada. We're even hearing about the need to eliminate partisanship and set up an organization. This organization would include department officials along with independent players, such as scientists, and it would remain above politics. This idea was brought up to us at the forum, and it was quite serious.

If you want to make greater use of the expertise of people on the ground and pursue your strong desire to save the fisheries for our children and grandchildren, as you put it, wouldn't you want to focus on an environmental mediation approach? Would you welcome the creation of a slightly more independent agency that—without necessarily playing a leading role—could certainly affect political decisions and make them less partisan?

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

First, if you just realized that we're out on the ground—

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

Thank you, Minister. I have to interrupt you—

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

—the reason is that you aren't on the ground.

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

—because we've gone over the two and half minutes.

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

If that were the case, you would know that I work closely with people on the ground and that I meet with associations—

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

Minister, we've gone over time. Madame Desbiens used more than her two and a half minutes for the question itself, so there's not much time for an answer. If you want, you can provide it in writing to the committee at a later date.

We'll now go to Ms. Barron for two and a half minutes or less.

Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC

Thank you, Chair. It's unlikely that I will take less.

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

I'll be the one controlling that.

Voices

Oh, oh!

Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC

I want to thank the interpreters. I appreciate that this has been a bit of a challenging meeting to interpret.

Minister, we have had an entire study at our committee about the derelict and abandoned vessels lining our coasts. In Nanaimo, Ladysmith and other coastal communities along Vancouver Island, we are particularly hard hit. In Ladysmith specifically, along the coast they have what's called the “dogpatch”, where vessels are all lined together and are sinking, polluting our marine ecosystems. It's a huge problem. It's an issue being brought to my attention over and over again, not just for the environmental impacts but also for the impacts on tourism and the safety implications for mariners.

Minister, we have the information. We are in the process of putting forward recommendations from this committee. Will you commit to helping clean up these vessels along our coasts and preventing them from...? It shouldn't be easier for Canadians to abandon a vessel than to clean it up properly. Can you commit today to working to get these recommendations implemented so that these vessels won't continue to line our coasts?

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

According to the information provided, since 2016, about 2,100 wrecked or abandoned vessels or dangerous vessels in Canadian waters have been reported. Of these vessels, 791 have been removed. At this time, 1,358 vessels remain in the national public inventory.

You're right to bring this up. We know about the environmental impact. The work in this area must continue.

Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC

Minister, can you commit to following through with the recommendations? I know that you haven't seen them yet, so I'll tell you about them. Sound recommendations have been put forward by witnesses who have come to our table and told us the solutions that need to be put forward. As a matter of fact, you can look at my bill. Everything the witnesses said coincides with the bill I put forward.

Can you please commit to helping clean up these vessels?

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

Yes, we'll make commitments within the confines of the allocated budget.

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

Thank you, Ms. Barron.

We have approximately six minutes left. I'll split it between Mr. Perkins and Mr. Cormier.

5:25 p.m.

Conservative

Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS

Why? Is that because of the technical delay? That's not fair.

The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald

That why I added two minutes.

5:25 p.m.

Conservative

Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS

Minister, in the summer and before this committee, you insisted that you were doing enforcement in the Bay of Fundy against lobster poaching. Is that still true? Do you still stand by that?

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

Mr. Perkins, I can see you getting agitated. I would ask you to show a bit more respect both for the interpreters and for the fact that I'm a francophone as opposed to an anglophone like you. I gave you time to ask your question, so you must give me time to hear the interpretation and respond.

5:25 p.m.

Conservative

Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS

You're going to try to burn up my time.

You insisted on enforcement. Your own department's documents—

Diane Lebouthillier Liberal Gaspésie—Les-Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

Illegal fishing and fisheries—

Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS

—show that there was no enforcement day by day in July, August and September.

Did you lie to this committee, or are you just ill informed about your department? There were zero days of enforcement—almost none. For only four days were there about five hours of enforcement on the Bay of Fundy in August.

Why did you mislead this committee?