Evidence of meeting #41 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was fishery.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:10 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Madame Desbiens. We'll now go to Ms. Barron for six minutes or less.
Go ahead, please.
4:10 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Thank you, Chair.
My first question is for Ms. Giffin.
Ms. Giffin, you said in your testimony that the Prince Edward Island Fishermen's Association is recommending a moratorium on the mackerel and herring seining fleet across the entire Atlantic region until the mackerel and herring stocks recover to the healthy zones. Please correct me if I got that wrong.
You went on to say that from the mid-2000s, small and large seiners used primarily in Newfoundland have accounted for the majority of Atlantic mackerel catches.
I'm wondering whether you think a moratorium on a particular type of fishing gear would impact the recovery of the Atlantic mackerel stocks.
4:10 p.m.
Marine Biologist and Industry Program Planner, Prince Edward Island Fishermen's Association
Thank you for the question.
The information that I passed along in my opening remarks is an actual quote from DFO, so it's not research I did; it's DFO work.
I do believe that in the immediate future, the moratorium on the seining fleet wouldn't make a whole lot of difference considering how low the tack is. But as we start getting up a bit higher and we're trying to grow that stock back to a healthy zone, those fish need an opportunity to get to that healthy zone and it's going to be much more difficult to achieve that when the seining fleet is out there, as Nathan said, taking everything in a school of fish.
4:10 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
What are your thoughts on how small and large seiners compare to other methods such as gillnets, jiggers and traps when fishing for Atlantic mackerel?
4:10 p.m.
Marine Biologist and Industry Program Planner, Prince Edward Island Fishermen's Association
We talk a lot about gear selectivity and the importance of gear selectivity. The hook and line and the gillnets, as Nathan pointed out, are much more selective than a seiner is. Also, with the hook and line, if you drop your hooks and you're in a school of small fish, then you can move very easily without harming that school, but with a seine fishery, the requirement is to actually encircle the fish, catch the fish and check them. It may cause harm in that case, beforehand, but all of those fish are ultimately taken anyway.
I think there's a lot to be said about focusing on gear selectivity when we're talking about rebuilding the stock and aiming towards those gear types that do less harm.
4:10 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Just so I understand, do you think that would be a more effective method than a moratorium? What are your thoughts on that?
4:10 p.m.
Marine Biologist and Industry Program Planner, Prince Edward Island Fishermen's Association
That brings into play the moratorium on seiners to focus on the inshore fleets that have hook and line and gillnets, which can cause less damage and allow the stock to rebuild while still allowing a small fishery.
4:10 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
This question is for Mr. Mallet.
You'd spoken about the little notice that was received around the moratorium and around the mackerel. We know that the closure of the commercial Atlantic mackerel fishery has had an impact on communities. I'm wondering if you can speak on whether any compensation arrangements were made for the commercial harvesters who were impacted by the closure or any consultation conducted. Can you expand a little bit on that?
4:10 p.m.
Executive Director, Maritime Fishermen's Union
That's a good question. There was absolutely no consultation in terms of what kind of aid program could be put in place.
The Maritime Fishermen's Union, along with our colleagues from the PEIFA and other associations, met with the minister's office—with the minister herself and with higher DFO officials as well—to talk about getting this closure at the last minute. When I say “last minute”, a few months before the start of the fishery for us is last minute. Our fishermen start preparing their gear well in advance, sometimes over a year ahead. They're also planning their business model in terms of having access to the bait fishery for their bait access for lobster fishing. Also, in the case of the fishermen who are more dependent on the pelagics, they have nowhere else to go. The herring stocks are going in a bad direction, as well, for the fall. In the herring fishery, we're seeing the same issue with seiners.
At the end of the day, there was not much consultation and no aid package. This is why I've been talking about the ALSM program that was put in place for lobster back in the early 2010s as a model that's been used and that has had huge success as maybe a way to move forward.
4:15 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Thank you.
Building off the topic of bait, I know Ms. Giffin talked about purchasing mackerel as bait from the U.S. and some of the implications around that, and I'm wondering if you could speak to the cost for harvesters of using local mackerel instead of imported mackerel as bait.
That would be to you, Mr. Mallet.
4:15 p.m.
Executive Director, Maritime Fishermen's Union
The cost is very significant when you buy mackerel from international markets. I mentioned in my presentation that just over the last year, we've seen an increase of about 35% in the cost of bait in terms of mackerel, and this was with the freezers already full this year from mackerel from last year, so what is it going to be next year when our local mackerel stocks are not used to replenish these local freezers?
I'm really fearful that the increase in price is going to be huge next year. It is fundamental for us that we at least reopen the bait fishery moving forward for 2023 and, through an investment program in the whole sector, look at other alternatives to supply our bait market with, for instance, some invasive species like Asian carp.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Ms. Barron.
We'll go to Mr. Perkins now for five minutes or less. Then we'll proceed to a short recess to do a vote.
November 15th, 2022 / 4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, witnesses, for appearing.
My question is for Mr. Hubley.
Mr. Hubley, you represent the Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen's Association. Can you briefly describe the range of species that the fishermen in your association catch?
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
It's everything from lobster to all groundfish, but there are a lot of mackerel around the bay this year, everywhere you could see, right from mid-May until now. There's still mackerel there.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
My understanding is that it's to ensure the bait fishery, but also the larger mackerel generally come by in the spring in sort of three waves. That's the really important fast season that I believe some of your members.... Lobster fishermen stop lobster fishing to go out to catch that. Is that correct?
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
Yes, the lobster guys will quit a month before the season's over in the spring to go mackerel trap fishing.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
When they're out there, they see it come by in two- or three-week waves of these larger fish, about two or three of them. Is that true?
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
Yes, in mid-May for a couple of weeks, there are the largest fish. Then they get progressively smaller for about six weeks. As the summer progresses, they get larger again, but they're not schooling then.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
The last couple of years before the moratorium, when your members were out, what were they seeing in terms of their ability to catch their TAC within the spring season?
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
The season before, as soon as the mackerel arrived, the minister shut it down for a week, and there were mackerel that whole week, all large mackerel. It would have been a bumper season if it weren't for that week. It really hurt.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
The year before that, when the minister.... I think it was Minister Jordan who interrupted the season, but what was the season like the year before that?
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
It was a good one.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
4:15 p.m.
Fisherman, Prospect Area Full-Time Fishermen’s Association
Fisheries had the numbers. Yes, I believe so, yes.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
In the absence of being able to catch them this year, your members have been out on the water fishing other species. In LFA 33, they're getting ready for the lobster season. What are they seeing?