Fisheries Committee on Nov. 29th, 2022

[Stephanie Hopper]

I can't answer that, actually. It has been there [Inaudible—Editor].

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Could you get back to the committee? Perhaps it's time we re-evaluated. The ceiling should be risen for this emergency situation, in order to allow port authorities to play a more substantial role in procuring the contracts they need to do repairs at their facilities.

[Stephanie Hopper]

We'll endeavour to get that information to you.

[Bobby Morrissey, Liberal, Egmont, PE]

Okay.

Ms. Cuddy, do you want to comment? I know it's local, but you deal extensively with the port authorities in Prince Edward Island. Some deal with small projects quite effectively. Is that a way of getting some of the money? Sometimes we may argue over whether a hundred million or several hundred million or a billion is enough. I'm hearing from a lot in the industry that we do have a capacity issue. One of them is contractors. We cannot deal with that. Are there adequate contractors around to provide this work in a timely manner? The other is the ability to get approvals to the local ports in a timely manner so that they can engage in some of this work themselves.

[Lori Cuddy]

For P.E.I. we have already engaged with the harbour authorities and have contracts with them for Fiona-related cleanup and those minor repairs that my colleague just mentioned.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Morrissey.

We'll now go to Madame Desbiens for six minutes or less, please.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for coming. We know that they have a lot to deal with, in this crisis situation where everybody is waving their flag at the same time. It's quite a complex issue and I extend my sympathy to them.

For my part, obviously, I am more concerned about the situation in Quebec. I have proposed a study on small craft harbours, which the committee will soon undertake, and I believe that hurricane Fiona will have highlighted the urgency of proceeding with this study.

In the meantime, do you have any idea how many decrepit ports in Quebec need to be brought up to speed quickly?

Do you have an estimate of what this will cost for Quebec? Do you do an assessment for each province?

[Stephanie Hopper]

We assess the needs of all our ports across the country. Of course, we also rely on our regional offices to prioritize. I don't have specific numbers for you today, but certainly there is a regular assessment of the condition of our ports to determine how and when the work needs to be done.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Could you send this information to the committee, so that we know where we stand and can form an opinion on it?

[Stephanie Hopper]

Yes, we can certainly provide that information. There are certain criteria that are evaluated.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Thank you.

I went to the Magdalen Islands before hurricane Fiona, and the situation at the Cap-aux-Meules wharf was already complex, given that it is partly under the jurisdiction of Transport Canada, supposedly, and partly under Fisheries and Oceans Canada. Some sort of barge was installed to increase the berthing space. However, it does not work when the boats arrive loaded with fish or lobsters. I have seen fishermen who had to manoeuvre to attach their boat to the barge and allow their colleagues to unload their cargo, because the barge would not allow them to do so. God knows that the main economic activity of the Magdalen Islands is lobster fishing, and all this makes the situation more complex. Hurricane Fiona added to this and highlighted the emergencies experienced on the Magdalen Islands and in various ports on both shores of Quebec.

Was there a plan before Fiona and, if so, was it changed? You've already done a lot, as we've seen, but the reason there was an urgency to do a study on small craft harbours was because there was still a lot to do.

Now that hurricane Fiona has passed, are you able to give us an order of magnitude of the additional costs it will have caused, compared to what you had anticipated?

Is my question clear?

[Stephanie Hopper]

I understand your question, but I don't have the answer. Unfortunately, we can't quantify that.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

You were probably already planning to invest some money in refurbishing the more decrepit ports, and Fiona will certainly have made them worse. So I imagine that there will be an increase in the investment needed. Has this been budgeted for?

[Stephanie Hopper]

We are continuing, as we always make sure we do, with the assessments I mentioned earlier and we factor them into our planning.

We are in the second year of implementation of the $300 million that was provided in Budget 2021. Projects and planning are ongoing.

As mentioned, there is also $100 million earmarked for small craft harbours, among other things, over the next two years. How that will be used is also part of our planning.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Do you think it would be necessary or appropriate to have a fund, plan or program to support infrastructure, given the new realities of climate change? Do you think it would be in the government's interest to plan for funds that might be needed in extreme cases where the lack of infrastructure would compromise fishing, for example?

[Stephanie Hopper]

I can't really comment on that. I do know, however, that in the $300 million announced following Fiona, there is the $100 million that I mentioned that is specifically for that, but as I understand it, it may also be for other purposes.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Is this enough?

[Stephanie Hopper]

Unfortunately, I am unable to answer this question today. This is not our area of expertise.

[Adam Burns]

What I can say is that we need to wait for the engineers to complete their work to determine the costs and to make plans to reopen the hurricane-damaged ports.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

You don't have set priorities, either. You're going to focus on what's most urgent, rather than the economic aspects of fishing. Is that kind of how you see the situation?

[Adam Burns]

Actually, we are doing both of these things at the same time. The idea is to put a plan in place so that fishers can continue to fish. In order to do that, we take both aspects into consideration.

[Caroline Desbiens, Bloc, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

I imagine you will proceed by priority.

Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Madame Desbiens.

We'll now go to Ms. Barron for six minutes or less.

[Lisa Marie Barron, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for being here again.

This will build off many of the questions that have been asked. We're hearing from witnesses over and over about absolutely the need for action to be taken immediately, so that we can ensure that fishers are out on the water as planned, but also about the importance of weather-resilient infrastructure or natural infrastructure. Through this process of rebuilding, what considerations are taken to ensure that we're not just continuing to put a band-aid solution on this but are actually rebuilding appropriately to take into consideration the future extreme weather events that will inevitably occur?

[Adam Burns]

Certainly, climate resilience in the infrastructure that we'll be rebuilding and repairing is one of the key or ultimate things we'll be asking the engineers who are doing the evaluations, and who ultimately will be doing the plans for those repairs, to keep in mind. The plans should reflect climate-resilient infrastructure. It's absolutely part of the plan.